No sarcasm left behind

September 27th, 2007 · 195 comments

Our anonymous contributor works part-time at a large, “troubled” high school in Milwaukee. Today, while making some copies, she found this anonymous wonder.

To: Staff Re: Hallways during lunch hours Do not expect the hallways to improve during lunch hours under the current administration. It's been going on for 3 years and is not about to change anytime soon. Do you wonder why you never see the Principal in the halls? I guess it's better to be blind to the situation that to have to come up with a policy to improve the conditions. Now let's get those test scores up and forget about school climate. Forget about low morale and a good working environment — get those test scores up! P.S. And don't forget to give you advocacy kids a BIG HUG today and everyday [sic]!

FILED UNDER: Milwaukee · office · raging against the machine · sarcasm · schools & teachers

195 responses so far ↓

  • #1   Team Cassandra bang

    ps. Its a little hard to keep test scores up in a nasty environment….just sayin’…

    Sep 27, 2007 at 10:41 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

    • #1.1   KT

      Uhhh… That’s the point………. I don’t think you’re getting the sarcasm here.

      Aug 14, 2008 at 1:59 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #2   Lashes

    Those test scores were fucking delicious!

    Sep 27, 2007 at 10:45 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #3   GVI bang

    Damn You Lashes!!

    But what I want to know is what is going on in the halls, is the Heisa Monster out there at lunch?

    Sep 27, 2007 at 10:50 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #4   Wade bang

    Maybe if they stopped serving Muscle Milk during the lunch hours, the climate might improve.

    Sep 27, 2007 at 10:52 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

    • #4.1   mcfreeze

      haha…you just made me spit out my muscle milk.

      Oct 2, 2008 at 1:27 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #5   lola bang

    The lack of color and font variation is depressing, much like the kids’ futures, I suspect.

    It’s Milwaukee. The public schools suck. Period.

    Sep 27, 2007 at 11:01 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #6   Wry Exchange

    Frisk those advocacy kids for weapons when you hug them! Every little bit helps.

    Sep 27, 2007 at 11:02 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #7   Lashes

    Sorry GVI. I’ve always wanted to do that!

    Sep 27, 2007 at 11:18 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #8   Wade bang

    After 3 three years of observing the advocacy kids dumping potting soil and peanut shells in the hallways during lunch hours, the staffer had two choices: bring in the heisa monster or print a sarcastic note and leave it in the copy room.

    P-A prevailed again!

    Sep 27, 2007 at 11:19 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #9   morpho aurora bang

    great snapshot of the educational system in milwaukee.

    Sep 27, 2007 at 11:21 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #10   GVI bang

    Yeah you should be Lashes, you beat me to it lol.

    Sep 27, 2007 at 11:25 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #11   Dave Ward

    Wow. That note is hardcore.

    Those sloppy joes were fucking delicious!

    Sep 27, 2007 at 11:40 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #12   WanderingPenguin bang

    See, I kind of thought the appropriate response would have been, “That principal was fuckin’ delicious!” since, you know, that would explain why you never see him in the halls. But hey, that’s just me. :)

    One bright spot: at least everything was spelled and punctuated properly in the note. That bodes well for the school’s future.

    Team high test scores and low morale!

    Sep 27, 2007 at 11:44 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

    • #12.1   Natasha

      Not true. Used “everyday” when “every day” would have been correct.

      May 4, 2009 at 11:44 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

    • #12.2   park rose

      Advocay kids are everyday people, just like you ‘n’ me ;) .

      May 5, 2009 at 1:53 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #13   WanderingPenguin bang

    And I must say I do find it amusing that about a week ago I seemed to be the only one (or one of a VERY few) still dragging that “fucking delicious” joke back from life support only to be lambasted for doing so. Now I see four or five attempts per thread and nobody seems to be upset. What’s up with that? (in the whiny voice of Jerry Seinfeld…)

    Not complainin’, mind yeh, jus’ sayin’… (now I’m talking in an old, toothless, hick voice…)

    Sep 27, 2007 at 11:47 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #14   lola bang

    WP – keep fightin’ the good fight

    revenge is best served when it’s fucking delicious

    Sep 27, 2007 at 11:49 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #15   Pot Still 'shiner

    I am on team “fucking delicious”!

    …and Thanks Terry

    Sep 28, 2007 at 12:01 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #16   GVI bang

    So does this mean that the fuckin delicious, is now fuckin delicious?

    Sep 28, 2007 at 12:12 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #17   GVI bang

    ps. shouldn’t we be thanking Kerry now?

    Sep 28, 2007 at 12:12 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #18   Juliet

    Pot still ‘shiner, you beat me to the “Thank You Terry”!

    Team Disgruntled Lunch Time Hall Monitor!!

    I am a Special Education Assistant I have worked in a school quite like the school described. I’ve seen all kinds of shenanigans, I’ve had kids blatantly ignore me; and also run away from me with the correct belief I could not chase them down. It’s funny now, but I totally relate to this P-A note. Without the principal backing you up it is hell. Hell, I tell you!

    Sep 28, 2007 at 12:24 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #19   Juliet bang

    I had to police middle school children around throwing sn0wballs! So retarded! Have you ever tried it? It’s an exercise in futility; just like willing the weather to be tropical and sunny during many Northern American winters is futile. Seriously, why bother? Let their parents sort it out I say.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 12:31 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #20   Tallulah

    Good thing Anthony Grosso doesn’t work there. He’d have to suck up all the horrible things Rene Hall is doing to him (Raping and killing him with cigarette smoke ) and focus ONLY on bring up the test scores, and oh yeah can’t forget the hugs!

    Thanks Terry.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 12:36 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #21   Canthz_B bang

    @#20 Authority figures throwing in the towel out of frustration, and you parents (I mean those that show up for parent-teacher meetings, not the cry-babies) are wondering why Johnnie can’t read? Discipline your brats before you send them out of your home . That or visit them where the State places them after trial.

    Team Mine Were Home Schooled And Are In College

    Sep 28, 2007 at 12:48 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #22   Lashes

    WP: Good call on the principal being fucking delicious. GVI damned me for beating him to it and I now damn you for one uping me on my first ever chance to be the first to say something was fucking delicious. DAMN YOU WP DAMN YOU!

    And I agree that fucking delicious is fucking delicious.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 12:52 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #23   Canthz_B bang

    Teaching kids how to pass a test instead of how to think is fucking delic.., well, just plain dumb.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 1:01 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #24   GVI bang

    Education is over-rated anyways. Who needs to read and write?

    Sep 28, 2007 at 1:04 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #25   Canthz_B bang

    Any Bookie!

    Sep 28, 2007 at 1:06 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #26   Brandi

    This comment does not particularly pertain to this post but why must every other word on these responses be an F-word??? It shows such a lack of class. I am not trying to be a some uptight fussbudget or anything. I was just wondering.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 3:22 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #27   Jen

    Brandi was fucking delicious.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 5:29 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #28   Andy bang

    Jen: LOL

    Brandi: Well, I would think the only time you really see a F-bomb is when it is accompanied by ‘delicious’.

    I still contend it goes back to the Outback bread post, and it doesn’t have the same “I don’t care about you, fuck you!” quality if you substitute the wording. WP, I’m one of the ones that has used it since its’ inception, I just try to find my spot. :)

    It seems that “Thanks Terry!” runs neck-and-neck with this gem, so your mileage may vary.

    As for the note, that’s just sad. It just has such a tone of surrender to it. That’s not a surprise it’s from a Milwaukee school. It’s good to know that Wisconsin being a top-5 tax state means top-notch schools, no? :P

    Sep 28, 2007 at 7:04 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #29   heisa

    those kids were fucking delicious.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 8:19 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #30   Katy

    I think cussing should no longer be taboo. If you’re going to cuss, go for the gold. It’s not going to make someone bleed or their head explode.

    Oh, and those advocacy kids were fucking delicious. XD

    Sep 28, 2007 at 8:19 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #31   Katy

    heisa: great minds think a like. You rock.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 8:20 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #32   Katy

    alike* rather…damn

    Sep 28, 2007 at 8:20 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #33   Fraulein N bang

    Jesus. This is the most depressing sort-of PA note ever.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 9:06 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #34   Josh

    No child left behind is fucking delicious.

    And yeah, you don’t know me.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 9:23 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #35   GhostWriter

    I love blamecasting Bush! First it was Katrina, and now we’ve pinned the hallways’ lack of improvement on him and his administration. We can always count on him to igonre the school climate, if global warming is any indication.

    …and although there have been many contenders this post, ( and for some odd reason, they still seem funny today- especially with a newcomer like Brandi) my nomination for “Mr. Fucking Delicious Milwaukee” is: Dave Ward and the Sloppy Joes! He earned extra points for bringing up a non-obvious but entirely appropriate food item.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 9:25 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

    • #35.1   PandoraWombat bang

      Isn’t “Bush” also the one who’s “using” the “women’s” “ladies room”? He never wore the right hat to the Mongolia BBQ, and he refuses to pay $5.00 to Casey in HR. His smoke is killing Terry, his entire cabinet is living in a frat house solely for the purpose of staying in a drunken stopper to keep some guy in the basement awake, and he keeps moving the fridge out to the curb. In addition, his rocketing pubes and cologne or whatever it is are making some “ladies” “throw up” in the “womens” “ladies room” — whom is “to” big of a job for the old pipes to handle. I would much Appreciate if he would stop.

      Aug 3, 2008 at 1:06 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #36   Jesus Christ

    What do you want ME to do about it?

    Sep 28, 2007 at 9:26 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #37   fussbudget bang

    stick to your guns Brandi, fussbudgeting is a lost art form

    Sep 28, 2007 at 9:27 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #38   Jesus Christ

    A plague on your hallways!

    Sep 28, 2007 at 9:28 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #39   mere bang

    so, to sum up:
    the heisa monster ate the kids. they were fucking delicious.
    thanks terry for everything.
    jesus would rather there be crowded halls, as long as noone parks on the school lawn..
    and someone stole my muscle milk and hot pockets.
    is that right?

    Sep 28, 2007 at 9:31 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #40   GhostWriter

    [aarrrrrttckkk!!] Attention all students – now playing in the hallways during lunch hours… “Dave Ward and the Sloppy Joes!

    That is all [clickktt!]

    Sep 28, 2007 at 9:41 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #41   the sos

    i parked on your lawn to worship jesus, and like a good fellow christian i thank him that childrens are learning – especially in laverne & shirlytown. and not that you care not to know, but the peanut shells, dirt, and ??? go behind the copier next to the heisa montser. thanks terry!

    Sep 28, 2007 at 9:49 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #42   T-Bone

    That note is really sad. It’s a helluva thing to have to wake up in the morning and be faced with obstacles like that, particularly when you’re a teacher. I get the impression they are laboring under complete chaos there. Very depressing. I’d write a note like that too!

    Sep 28, 2007 at 9:53 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #43   lauralaiwc

    #25, i wish you would have written that:

    ejukashon iz overaited neway. hoo kneeds 2 reed and rite?

    but i feel for the teacher who wrote this dripping with sarcasm note. parents dont discipline their crappy kids, and then “authority figures” leave their balls at home in their purse. so there is no one backing them. its a vicious circle.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 9:58 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #44   Raymond

    It’s a highschool for ‘troubled’ kids, which means they probably aren’t going anywhere in life anyways, right?

    Sep 28, 2007 at 10:02 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #45   GVI bang

    Aww man, I see what you mean Lauralai, oh well maybe next time.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 10:05 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #46   WanderingPenguin bang

    Lashes: not to worry – being first with the comment is still the, er….fucking deliciousest. :)

    Andy: I know, I wasn’t actually bitter – I just play it on TV. I actually thought it was damned funny that things were slowing down on that front until somebody jumped on here for ONE comment and stirred the pot up….and now it’s an epidemic!

    I love it when things work out that way.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 10:38 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #47   little voice

    We were talking about this very thing in our office yesterday. I feel so sorry for school kids. They won’t be able to function when they leave school. I hope I’m wrong!

    Sep 28, 2007 at 10:46 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #48   Mishee bang

    Does anybody else have a problem with these teachers hugging the kids? I mean, I don’t think that’s really allowed anymore, isn’t it? I just find that line kinda creepy in a non-creepy way.. I mean, I understand what they are saying, but some people might not, and there’s always the chance of those bad eggs being around too!

    Sep 28, 2007 at 11:01 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #49   lola bang

    I think she was being sarcastic about the hugs. I have a feeling the kids need something a little stronger than hugging.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 11:10 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #50   mattiff

    I blame mother, because as we all know “your mother doesn’t work here”. but if she did, those hallways would be much improved.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 11:14 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #51   WanderingPenguin bang

    Something such as muscle milk, lola?

    Sep 28, 2007 at 11:31 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #52   lola bang

    Teachers tend to get in trouble when they start administering muscle milk to jail bai… uh, teenagers

    I imagine that the janitor closets are already full of pre-pregnant teens

    Sep 28, 2007 at 11:42 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #53   Dave Ward bang

    @Penguin: My personal goal is to deliberately run ‘fucking delicious’ into the ground so that nobody finds it funny anymore, and so that there’s nobody left who isn’t sick of it.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 12:02 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #54   Mishee bang

    Well Dave the collective mental age of these posters is probably an average of about 16, so you might be waiting quite a while!

    P.S. That personal goal is fucking delicious!!

    Sep 28, 2007 at 12:16 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #55   Mishee bang

    And just so everyone knows, I was not excluding myself from the mental age comment above… I know what I am!

    Sep 28, 2007 at 12:20 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #56   Jesus Christ

    All praise Dave, for he has a god complex.

    Church wafers are NOT fucking delicious, but sloppy joes are the shiznittle. Amen.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 12:23 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #57   April bang

    What the hell is an advocacy kid anyway?

    Are they the ones advocating mayhem, death and destruction in the hallways or are they the future lawyers advocating change of hallway behavior? I’m confused. I’m pretty sure, either way, that you will note find me hugging them. That’s a lawsuit just waiting to happen.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 12:30 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #58   anglophile

    An interesting note about the word fucking. It’s one of the few word in English that function as an infix, as in: “Will we ever see the principal in the hallway?” “Abso-fucking-lutely not!” It has its place in linguistics. Team F-bomb!

    Sep 28, 2007 at 12:33 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #59   April bang

    Yeah, that “note” was supposed to be a “not” – sorry about that.

    Team re-read before posting!

    Sep 28, 2007 at 12:36 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #60   Juliet

    I second Dave’s personal goal. It is really fucking delicious.

    I will savour it until the end.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 12:48 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #61   Team Cassandra

    anglophile: You reminded me that (I think) it was George Carlin who taught me that the word: “fuck” is one of the only words in the English language that can be used in any way possible:
    fuck (verb, exclamation), fucking (verb, adverb, adjective), fucked (past tense verb, adjective), fuckfaced (prefix), and so on…

    Sep 28, 2007 at 1:08 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #62   Andy

    WP: I didn’t mean to seem like I was calling you out on anything, I was just talking like an old-timer, like “Back in my day…”

    You’re right. There was a dry spell for awhile, now we are awash in it, not that it’s so horrible, in my opinion. :D

    Sep 28, 2007 at 1:26 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #63   Stephanie

    Advocacy kids are like the behavioral class. The have entire schools devoted to them now. Because you can’t beat your kids anymore, so they become crime-committing, raping, thieving, pregnant teenagers. All thanks to Terry.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 1:32 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #64   Jen

    Keep those English test scores up – if only they tested something the Advocacy Students could really get a fucking handle on

    Sep 28, 2007 at 1:33 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #65   Goldie

    So what’s going on in those hallways?
    Can I score some pot over there?

    Sep 28, 2007 at 1:39 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #66   claw71

    To: Staff
    Re: Re: Hallways During Lunch Hours.

    It has come to my attention that there are some issues with the way the administration is handling the hallways during lunch hours. Sadly, during our most recent inservice day nobody seemed to have any suggestions. All of the teachers crowded toward the back of the room and refused to participate in the discussion.

    Do you know why you don’t see your principal in the halls? Because he is in his office working. He is on the phone with the superintendent explaining low test scores. He is also on the phone with the city prosecutor trying to find out why teachers are hugging their advocacy students even though policy formally states that physical contact is forbidden. Your principal is working so hard trying to keep this school from going under that it makes him wonder who on his staff has enough time to lament the condition of the hallways. Furthermore, the principal is wondering why somebody on his staff, a staff granted considerable authority over the students, would feel powerless to address the issues in the hallway. You are a teacher and while you might have more productive things to do than bitch and moan you are well within the scope of your power to DO YOUR FRIGGING JOB!

    PS: If you don’t get those test scores up you’ll be working at McDonalds where those advocacy students will be your supervisors.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 2:09 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #67   GhostWriter

    The note may have been an actual memorandum from the real school Principal (who acts just like Michael from “the Office”).

    He’s just trying to offer the teachers some sage advice: “If you don’t like the hallways, then stay the heck out of them, like I do!”

    Sep 28, 2007 at 2:09 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #68   GhostWriter

    DAMMIT cla71! How’d you do that?!?! Three seconds before my comment…

    Sep 28, 2007 at 2:11 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #69   zsa

    It would have been better GW, if yours came first and then claw exapanded on it, but since I read these things from the bottom up anyway- it worked for me =)
    Great Minds Think Alike (if you are ok with being compared to claw in the “Great Minds” category)

    Sep 28, 2007 at 2:24 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #70   zsa

    which- now that I think about it- is about as creepy as hugging advocacy kids.

    sorry bout that

    Sep 28, 2007 at 2:25 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #71   WanderingPenguin bang

    Nah, Andy, it’s all good – didn’t think you were calling me out on anything. I guess I just felt guilty about my original comment or something. I second your sentiment about it not being a bad thing, BTW.

    Hey, did anyone else find it kind of chuckle-worthy that “anglophile” typed, “It’s one of the few word in English…” (post #59) where it should have been “wordS”? That tickled my funnybone. I love ironic typos the best.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 2:29 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #72   Lurker

    First, I don’t want some idiot who doesn’t know the difference between “everyday” and “every day” teaching my kids. No wonder the test scores are so low!

    Second, as claw71 said, school boards and parents alike have a big problem with staff getting touchy-feely with kids. Even the “advocacy” ones.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 2:37 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #73   Wade bang

    claw – your post #67 was frigging delicious. :)

    Sep 28, 2007 at 2:42 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #74   anglophile

    Cassandra, I agree whole-heartedly with George Carlin about the usefulness of The F-Word.

    WP, don’t think I didn’t notice my typo. I just find it a little wearying to read all these “oops, I made a typo” posts, so I didn’t write one. It actually was because I first typed that fucking was the only word (no s) in the English language that is also an infix, but in the middle of typing, I remembered fricking (derivative, but still a word) and blooming, which are also used as infixes, so I corrected myself in the interests of accuracy. Thanks for not also pointing out my subject/verb disagreement.

    No, I’m not a public school English teacher, just someone who speaks, and writes, English.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 2:57 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #75   WanderingPenguin bang

    I think the whole point of the P.S. was to mock the principal even further. I would imagine the principal was a big believer in hugging the advocacy kids and it’s likely this teacher is completely against the whole idea. Also, it’s entirely possible that a memo from said principal contained the phrase, “Hug your Advocacy Kids today and everyday!” The spelling error might not have even been made by the teacher who wrote this note.

    Just my thinking, of course.

    Also, though I agree with claw in principle (principal? ;) ), the truth is that there is only so much a teacher can threaten a student with if they don’t behave. Chief on that list is a visit to the principal’s office for further measures, but this is not much of a threat if that principal is a milquetoast, touchy-feely, “laissez faire” kind of person. My sister is hamstrung by just exactly this kind of principal in her school (the school were she teaches, I mean). She and her colleagues routinely sent the “evildoers” to see the principal and they were sent right back to their classes with a pat on the back and an admonishment to “try a little harder”.

    Well, make that “WAS hamstrung”: the parents finally succeeded in forcing his sorry ass out of the position and a new guy is in charge now – thank God!

    Sometimes you’ve just had enough, I imagine.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 3:05 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #76   WanderingPenguin bang

    Uh, I didn’t point out your “subject/verb” disagreement because your message made it obvious to me that you only left the “s” off of “words”, making the subject and verb completely agree in the intended meaning of your post. It would have pretty stupid of me to comment that you left the “s” off of “words” and then also mention that “function” does not modify “word” correctly. Only one of those errors could actually be possible, really. If you had said, “…is a word that function…”, then that would have been an entirely different mistake. That is why I did not point it out.

    It doesn’t matter to me that you find it “too wearying” to remark on your own typo; my only comment was related to someone who calls himself or herself an “anglophile” but doesn’t mind not correcting a glaring error in their own posting that they later profess to have noticed. I found that to be deliciously ironic and decided to comment on it as such.

    Although I guess it would have been worse had you called yourself a “linguaphile” or even “logophile”. I suppose it’s very possible to love England but not be a protector of its native language. So there’s that, at least. Sorry to get your nose out of joint.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 3:18 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #77   anglophile

    Oh, no, you misread me. Damn innernets! Nose still perfectly jointed!

    Sep 28, 2007 at 3:22 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #78   anglophile

    Must remember to use smilies everyday.


    Sep 28, 2007 at 3:23 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #79   Lurker

    Certainly possible that “BIG HUG today and everyday” comes from the principal and is quoted in sacrasm. If that was the case, I tend to think the author would have put quotation marks on it, but not necessarily.

    Either way, it’s a sorry statement about the school.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 3:25 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #80   Heather

    Ah, glad to see my hometown is doing its part.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 3:25 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #81   WanderingPenguin bang

    …and because I DON’T find it “wearying” to correct my own mistakes after the fact, I would like to point out that I missed an “h” in my post #76: “…the school wHere she teaches…” is how it should have read. Mea maxima culpa.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 3:30 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #82   WanderingPenguin bang

    Oh, anglophile, I am very sorry I misread you. Now I’m even sorrier for my tone in post #82. :) You’re absolutely right about the ‘net.

    I originally intended the whole “ironic” comment to be amusing. See how quickly it can snowball when one person (me, in this case) is wound too tightly?

    Sorry about that. :) Heartiest congratulations to your nose, which obviously “nose” better.

    Sorry about THAT, too. :)

    Sep 28, 2007 at 3:32 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #83   WanderingPenguin bang

    Lurker, I completely agree about the quotation marks. In fact, I intended to put that in my post but somehow forgot to do so. You’re probably right about that – and completely right about the sorry commentary on the school.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 3:33 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #84   WanderingPenguin bang

    Well, since there’s no troublemaker counter any more, I will take my leave as my working day (such as it is) is done. :) Next thread, all. Sorry for the verbal diarrhea this afternoon. Blaming it on a sunny Friday in these parts!

    Sep 28, 2007 at 3:34 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #85   GhostWriter

    claw71 and myself may be sworn arch-enemies, but we never stoop to the sickening level of ingratiatingly apologizing for misinterpreting the other’s previous apology to each others’ misinterpretation. Nothing is all smiley-face about that game.

    Now excuse me, for I must plot claw71’s doom, (with zsa as my unwitting accomplice).

    Sep 28, 2007 at 3:47 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #86   GVI bang

    Unless one of these teacher’s is Jesus, then I don’t think they should be hugging children.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 4:02 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #87   Mishee bang

    GVI, I don’t even think it would be appropriate to get Hugs from Jesus in this instance!

    Sep 28, 2007 at 4:07 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #88   GVI bang

    At least we can trust Jesus with the kids.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 4:14 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #89   sise bang


    Sep 28, 2007 at 4:34 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #90   Wade bang


    Our president needs you, lol!

    Bush – Childrens do learn when standards are high and results are measured.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 5:11 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #91   Juliet

    Rarely is the question asked: is our children learning?

    Sep 28, 2007 at 5:14 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #92   Juliet

    Re: post #67:

    Yep, the principal is a busy person. Unfortunately the principal is the only person who can set and truly enforce a policy around behaviour. Usually there are TA’s or volunteer parents monitoring kids during recess and lunch. If the principal doesn’t have an effective policy around behaviour in place then the kids quickly learn who is in charge: them. Ever had someone give you choices they couldn’t back up?

    If you think the teachers should be better authoritarians you have not been in a school for a long time.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 5:58 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #93   Juliet

    I challenge you to make thirty unruly children behave day in and day out for slightly more money than a dishwasher makes.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 6:00 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #94   claw71 bang

    Since GhostWriter didn’t include an evil laugh in his post I can only assume that I’m the bad guy in this epic struggle.

    And it’s important to note that my accomplices are far from unwitting. I am Legion.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 6:03 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #95   anglophile

    Look, all WP and I are trying to do is keep the Passive in the PA. Claw and GW are all too much with the Aggressive.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 6:11 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #96   IgnatiusReilly

    I certainly wouldn’t want someone who can’t tell the difference between “everyday” and “every day” to be teaching my children.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 6:15 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #97   Team Cassandra bang

    Dearest Juliet.

    Having seeing you come back so recently compelled me to write slightly before I’m ready…so this is not the list.

    This thread gives me a pain in my heart.

    Everybody needs to take a



    The problem in this situation is actually one of perception. It is perceived that arms development and space travel is more valuable than childhood development.

    People, in general also far more willing to way more time money on entertainment than on education.

    The children are unruly because they need validation and guidance. They need to learn simple things like how to set and protect boundaries for themselves (respectfully) by watching us set and protect our own boundaries (respectfully). If they’re doing it because they need attention then I don’t see why anyone would naysay that – human beings need attention, in fact; its necessary to our ability to develop socio-emotionally. Even this letter is a cry for attention. Maybe nothing else worked.

    They need you to spend time *seeing* them develop…not just checking test scores – they need to know that the work and/or play their involved in is valuable…they can only know the value by example – you can’t *say* its important and then leave them to themselves to figure it out. Then they just think you’re a liar – if you don’t care, why should I?

    You can’t do that at 30 children to 1 teacher – you just can’t. You can’t begin to know all the inner workings of 30 children well enough to give them what they need (never mind the time it takes to give it) which is what will help them settle down; which is what will help you to best guide them through their work. And I honestly don’t think that, on average, parents are helpful. To be honest, I think they’re tired.

    We’re constantly rushing them through their childhood to learn this or that, in pursuit of the Golden Ticket and we teach them to run on the wheel just like we do…

    ((WARNING: HUGE DIGRESSION)this frustrates me the most because: what are we running for? We’re not settling this great land any more or running from disaster – what is the big rush in this day and age? Isn’t that what are forefathers were tryna get for us: peaceful and plentiful existence? What are we tryna get now?)

    And we get mad at kids cuz they misbehave, but really – they should be mad at us becuz we, continually, give them the short end of our attention, when we live in the land of plenty (and don’t think they don’t notice that) and they’re supposed to be our future.


    PS. stupendously hilarious recaps coming soon in The List!

    Sep 28, 2007 at 6:38 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #98   Team Cassandra bang

    So obnoxious, I know but I didn’t even begin to finish this sentence (and there’s no edit!):

    People, in general, are also far more willing to spend way more time and money on entertainment than on education.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 6:42 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #99   zsa

    Hey GW~ who said I was un-witting? I have lots of wit…in there somewhere. Meet me behind the barn and we can hatch our plans

    Sep 28, 2007 at 6:55 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #100   GVI bang

    #98 T_C, that rant was fucking gourmet

    Sep 28, 2007 at 7:14 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #101   GVI bang

    #98 T_C, now thats a fucking gourmet rant.

    ps. Zsa you made it to 100.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 7:15 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #102   Canthz_B bang

    Oh so tired of the excuses.
    Maybe I have not been a student for some time, but we had 30 kids in our classrooms in the Middle Ages too. We learned, we behaved, we did our homework without all of the self-esteem building drivel. We were in school to learn. Our parent(s) went off to work and got paid, we went to school for an education.
    There were no dyslexics or ADHD kids, no Ritalin…just sit down, shut up and do the work and stop making excuses!
    The ugly bottom line is that the more students a school can label as “Special Needs”, the more lovely State aid the school receives.
    Parents, rais your children and stop expecting the school to do it for you! Skip the i-Pod and buy some books for your home. Spend time to help your children do their homework and stop doing it for them so that they can get a good grade and feel proud of themselves And above all, don’t just look at the grade on the paper, read the paper to see if the grade is deserved…can your child really read or do fractions, or is she just getting good grades and moved along through the school system?

    P.S. The best teachers are NOT in it for the money! Higher salaries attracts those who value cash over children. Stop throwing money at the problem.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 7:41 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #103   Canthz_B bang

    Wow…I wonder how many of the education/child self-esteem experts here have ever actually raised children?

    Some comments make me fear for today’s children.

    I have read more excuses for failed parents and children than I can believe.
    It is not the function of the schools to raise your children people. You made them. Their potential for success in life begins and ends in your home.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 7:46 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #104   Ceryniti

    It wasn’t George Carlin who came up with the Fuck in the English language, it was Lenny Bruce. But Carlin did it again at a show to show support of Lenny. Fuck yeah.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 8:59 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #105   lola bang

    I don’t know if I’d want Jesus hugging my children, what with his lack of pants and everything.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 9:18 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #106   Team Cassandra bang

    Now that I’ve brought y’all way down let’s go back up on the Team Cassandra Rollercoaster!

    #1 because I was First! (to be honest, I’m glad we don’t do that, it looks so silly when 7 people say it – i hereby, solemnly, promise to never do it again.)

    There seems to be some good advice at #90, #79 & #66 and interesting synchronizing with #97 and #73.

    At #37 Jesus asks a questions and Dave steps up with a personal goal #54, #55, #61 which is, apparently nixed by Jesus at #57.

    We question the safety of Jesus at #87,#88,#89 and come up 2 to 1 against.

    #67&#68 got down to the reality of the situation while #40′s got the Big Picture.

    You won’t believe this but #25, #27, #29,#30,#31,#38,#39,#62, and #72 all discuss language arts…and I didn’t the numbers but there was a whole lotta apologizing going on today – nice to see everybody playing nice:)

    GW disagrees (and makes me chuckle) at #86.

    #53 I think pre-pregnant girls are, prolly, all the rage.

    and #95 for some reason, I really dig you being Legion.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 9:22 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #107   anglophile bang

    Wade: click on subscribe to comments on this post to see more.

    Sep 28, 2007 at 10:46 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #108   WanderingPenguin bang

    Here I am again on this thread. So I lied. So sue me. :)

    In case we are actually counting for canthz, *raises hand* I have raised two kids to university and nearly-university age. I don’t think I’m one of the posters at issue in your comment, canthz, but you did (sort of) ask. :)

    Re #91 – sorry, Wade, but y’all elected him – TWICE!?! – so you’re gonna have to fix it yourself. Up here we have a whole other idiot to worry about. :)

    #96 – anglophile, you are hysterical. I am sorrier by the minute I took you wrong!

    And lastly, #97 – er, lurker? Did you come clean with your “real name”? Or is there an echo in here?

    BTW, I can see posts up through 110. Am I missing some?

    Sep 29, 2007 at 12:26 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #109   lola bang

    WP – the posts were gone for a short while but returned! Yay!

    Oh yeah, the US electoral college sucks my white ass. I’d rather listen to 24-hour polka music than anything that KeeblerElf-wannabe-with-a-Milwaukee-Public-School-education says.

    Sep 29, 2007 at 12:46 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #110   Canthz_B bang

    #111 WP, we didn’t all elect him, he won by less than one percentage point. I will not attempt to explain the electoral college to you…mostly because it baffles the hell out of us!

    Job well done, or nearly done on the Penguin Chicks (age not gender).

    Sep 29, 2007 at 12:56 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #111   Canthz_B bang

    One real pet peeve is people who complain about their local schools but have never taken their child to a free public library, museum, zoo or aquarium. Even walked their own downtown in rural areas and talked to their child about the local war memorial (almost everywhere has at least one, the war memorialize matters not).
    I mean , if you don’t care about educating your spawn, what makes you think there is someone who cares more?

    Sep 29, 2007 at 1:11 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #112   Canthz_B bang

    Sorry to apologize…oops, sorry I apologized for apologizing!!

    Awww Hell

    Sep 29, 2007 at 1:13 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #113   Team Cassandra bang

    Hey Canthz –

    I’m in the process of raising my own – and I’ve raised 2 others as well (not mine)…

    I will say that the big issue for me is not that children sit down and shut up but that they live in an environment that promotes their natural interest in learning. People LOVE to learn – so why do kids hate school? Ever find out what happened to the other 29 people in your class? I wonder what happiness/success rate is there…

    Also – Thank you, thank you, thank you GVI!

    Sep 29, 2007 at 1:31 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #114   Team Cassandra bang

    PS. if you had the real lowdown on teacher and caregiver wages (especially when compared to the cost of living) you, most certainly, be worried that we were throwing too much money at them. Why *shouldn’t* teachers expect good money? Why shouldn’t their love and devotion be rewarded in that way? A really good teacher is just as professional as any doctor or lawyer and just as valuable, IMO. That’s exactly what I mean about perception.

    In other news – the break in visible posts meant that I missed #107 making it 3 to 1 against a child’s exposure to Jesus’ loving arms:)

    Sep 29, 2007 at 1:45 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #115   Canthz_B bang

    TC I have kept in touch with many of those classmates on….nearly all are well thanks.
    Our natural interest in learning was that it was just what we were supposed to be doing as kids. As you say there is a natural interest in learning…it needs no promotion. If more time were spent teaching and less in psychoanalysis perhaps the schools would again work for the children instead of the teachers’ unions.
    Why do kids hate school?…Because school is not fun, it is not supposed to be fun and as soon as the educators decided to try and make it fun the whole shebang went south!
    Just teach the kids, parents can provide fun as they see fit. Should we all stop earning money because work is not fun?
    Excuses, excuses. :-(
    Should school only be attended on nice, sunny days?
    As far as the ultimate “environment issue” the schools just love to fall back on (the child has a bad home-life) it is a white elephant in the sense that the school should reflect the rules and mores of society and as such can function as a safe zone for that child only when it enforces the rules, not when it turns it’s back and labels the child as troubled.
    My points are that parents are failing their children, schools are failing society, but no one is saying “I should step up and do better.”
    So blame the environment all you like but multitudes have received excellent education in veritable shacks.

    Sep 29, 2007 at 1:56 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #116   Canthz_B bang

    #117 TC, If we had “real good teachers” we would not have this conversation.
    I cannot speak to all points on Earth but in NJ teachers are paid quite well….or they strike and keep the children home.
    Money does not equal excellence.
    If we were in the perfect society and all teachers graduated from teachers’ colleges, with degrees in education, only 20% would graduate in the top 80% of their class. The rest would still have degrees, but what would they really be worth?

    Sep 29, 2007 at 2:01 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #117   Canthz_B bang

    Still laughing at real good teachers!
    My daughter had one that thought Puerto Rico was a State, another that thought a tomato was a vegetable. I have seen spelling and grammatical errors by teachers (and yes, on the blackboard) that would make your skin crawl.
    A title does not create a professional.
    When I was in school in the Middle Ages, teachers stayed at school until 4pm. By the time my children were in elementary school at 3:05pm the teachers had almost all gone for the day. Need to have a conference? Take a day off and see the teacher at 10am. What’s that? how about 3:30 in the afternoon? No I’m sorry, cannot see you then.
    Yet one of the first things teachers say is that they need more parental involvement. Try that and see how fast the teachers run when they see you coming.
    Sorry to seem to rand, or actually to be ranting, but I have walked this mile and it makes me want to puke!!!

    Sep 29, 2007 at 2:14 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #118   Zelanie bang

    If the principal won’t even come out in to the halls when it’s the only chore he has around here, maybe we should stack the advocacy kids in the middle of his office until he notices them and (3 days later) finally gets around to hugging them.

    Sep 29, 2007 at 2:19 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #119   No Brainer

    If you teach them, they will learn.

    Sep 29, 2007 at 2:40 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #120   lola bang

    canthz – maybe the teachers were running from you, not all parents! you are very opinionated – I’d avoid you, too :)

    I disagree that we should pay teachers less because there are some teachers out there who are not all that great. (I’ve known some great teachers in my day, some mediocre ones, as well as those that probably should be fired from stupidity.)

    Does that mean we should pay all doctors less because there are some that are jaded? Or maybe librarians because there are some who aren’t very polite? Or maybe construction workers because they sometimes annoy us with detours?

    I get the argument, but if that logic works, we’d all see across-the-board paycuts because of some dumbshits who can’t do their jobs!

    PS – I loved school, but disliked some of my teachers. Learning can be fun and effective, IMO.

    PPS – Where were ya last night?

    Sep 29, 2007 at 9:33 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #121   WanderingPenguin bang

    canthz, I’m not sure who you were quoting with the “real good teachers”, or was it an inside joke? It looks to me like TC wrote “realLY good teachers”…. but that may well not be what you were laughing at. No coffee yet = me, slow on on the uptake. :)

    Also, sorry to do this to you but re #120 – “By the time my children were in elementary school at 3:05pm…”

    Wow! Your kids were so lucky! I had to be at school at 8:30 AM most days – and they didn’t have to be there until after 3 PM! ;)

    Sep 29, 2007 at 10:16 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #122   BoggyWoggy

    The scene? Public High School
    The issue? Wild hallways
    The characters? 14, 15, 16, 17, and 18 year-olds
    The solution? Yeah, right!

    Outside of getting a bullhorn and screaming in kids’ ears, without armed guards, there very little you can change in a school hallway.

    And to those who are making negative remarks about teachers, go into a classroom, yourself, for just 1 day and see what YOU can do.

    From Your Friendly Neighborhood Teacher…

    Sep 29, 2007 at 12:38 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #123   Canthz_B bang

    WP, Thanks. I am not, nor do I prefess to be a professor of English. I am pretty sure my meaning was clear enough to most. I ask now for future forgiveness if I err grammatically because I do not intend to change.

    BTW, I placed no quotation marks and
    so was quoting no one with “real good teachers”.

    Sep 29, 2007 at 12:41 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #124   BoggyWoggy

    Errr…I hate my wireless keyboard. It can’t keep up with my speedy fingers…

    Insert “is” between there and very above.

    And, yes, there are some horrid teachers. But, consider this: In order to be considered “highly qualified” under the No Child Left Behind Act, after completing my Masters Degree in Education and getting 2 endorsements (ESOL and Mathematics) as an elementary teacher, I was required to also take the Praxis Exam at a local university. I passed with flying colors, thereby, allowing me to send home letters, as required by law, to all parents in my classroom, indicating that I am a “highly-qualified educator.”
    On the flip side…there are absolutely NO STANDARDS to dictate what it means for one to be considered a “highly-qualified PRESIDENT.”
    Think about it…

    Sep 29, 2007 at 12:44 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #125   WanderingPenguin bang

    Uh, do you not even read your own posts properly, Canthz_B? I was not correcting your grammar, I was just asking what you were laughing at. Here is what you wrote in post #119;

    ‘#117 TC, If we had “real good teachers” we would not have this conversation.’

    You clearly did place quotation marks around “real good teachers”, which is why I was asking you why you did so. I’m sorry you thought I was correcting your grammar; in fact, I was asking you whose grammar you were correcting. I was only looking for enlightenment, not condemning you. It honestly had never occurred to me – until now – that the grammatical error might have been yours. I actually thought you were commenting on a post I missed and simply got your reference number wrong. I think the phrase “real good teachers” is up there with “childrens do learn” and I had hoped it was deliberate with humourous (Canadian spelling there) intent.

    I’m not even going to MENTION how interesting it was that you said “prEfess to be a prOfessor of English” in post #126. ;)

    Oops, sorry. :)

    Sep 29, 2007 at 12:51 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #126   Canthz_B bang

    Lola, I’m not saying pay teachers less, just stop rewarding those who have not earned a reward.
    I loved school too, as you can see I’m competitive so I made my own fun.
    Personally in my profession (if I can call it that) failure to maintain quality of 97% monetary and 95% overall results in termination. When 60% of kids complete 12th grade and this is reported as proof that the schools are improving, I despair.
    I am indeed opinionated, but my concern was that my children be educated. I made the time to be involved from day one (I think I learned enough ballet to do some neat tricks!) :-)

    Sep 29, 2007 at 12:52 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #127   Canthz_B bang

    My bad, I looked at the closest post of mine to yours. Spelling errors happen while typing out a thought and though we mean to go back after
    that thought is completly put down, we sometimes fail to do so.
    But since you are perfect, Why explain that to you? You clearly kow all.

    Sep 29, 2007 at 12:56 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #128   Team Cassandra bang

    I feel like I should say something but all I can think of is this:

    My work is fun:) Sometimes its hard (or “challenging”, as we say) and yes – sometimes, I procrastinate – but its still fun. Just, sometimes, I feel like doing something else – and sometimes I can. It all goes somewhere, if I apply a certain focus – and its a calm and happy experience. I want everybody to feel it, especially children – it just feels really good. I just don’t get why its not ok to feel good.

    Sep 29, 2007 at 12:58 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #129   Canthz_B bang

    TC, don’t misunderstand me…I recognize the fact that there are some outstanding educators out there doing the hard work every day. My displeasure is more with the system than it is with those who perform within it.

    Sep 29, 2007 at 1:08 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #130   WanderingPenguin bang

    Well, no, I am not perfect, but I do try to be careful about denying things that are clearly put down in black & white. This is not the first time I have seen you do that.

    I was greatly amused by the line “real good teachers” and all I wanted to know, since you were QUOTING it, was who said it originally so I could get in on the fun. As I said, it never occurred to me that it might have been your own ironic error – not that that should really matter, because it’s damned funny. However, I really wasn’t coming down on you and, like myself yesterday in my regrettable snappy response(s) to anglophile, I think this time your shorts are in a bit of a knot. To quote your own self a couple of threads ago: “I apologize for the misunderstanding.”

    I am rather tired of you insulting people as a matter of knee-jerk response, however, so I think in the interests of goodwill we should probably just not respond to each other’s notes for the forseeable future. Sound fair?

    Ok, this time for keeps: off to the next thread, whenever that shows up!

    Sep 29, 2007 at 1:08 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #131   Canthz_B bang

    Sounds fair.
    And in the interest of good will, WP, perhaps you could scale back the constant correcting of posts. If this were a Grammar Police website I could understand, even revel in, the faults you find…but it is not. Not every error needs pointing out (Holy Water or Holy Wine…we got the damned point that the writer wanted to convey).

    Sep 29, 2007 at 1:43 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #132   Wade bang

    Wooooof! Nothing gets the blood pumping like a spirited debate over pedagogy. :)

    I grew up in a military family, so I got to attend 4 elementary schools, 2 junior highs and 2 high schools (all public or DOD overseas). I also worked on a college campus for a decade.

    Here are some obervations (for what it’s worth):

    1. I couldn’t always tell whether someone was coming from a home school, public school or private school background…but I could always when their parent(s) and/or guardian had been actively engaged in their education.

    2. My background, while stressful, gave me the advantage of learning how to study/play/relate to folks who were completely different from me. The ideal of desegregation in America was largely circumvented by white flight to the suburbs (with separate school districts and private academies – many of which sprang up the same day as desegregation orders).

    3. Warehousing “advocacy kids” just makes it easier for everyone else – ship off the troublemakers.

    4. Unwieldy, industrial model high schools are too large. I realize it is an attempt to apply economies of scale (plus increase the potential of a really good football team). But the result is overcrowding and disruption – which leads to point #3.

    5. Teachers face a constant battle for the attention of their students, driven by everything from home distractions to the entertainment industry. The good ones figure out how to make learning both challenging and fun.

    Well, to paraphrase Sam Sharpnose in “Big Jake”, that’s more words than I’ve posted in a long time.

    Oh, and WP – we didn’t elect him the first time, lol.

    Sep 29, 2007 at 2:12 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #133   Wade bang


    Oh those s’s are soooo tricksy!!

    Sep 29, 2007 at 2:13 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #134   Canthz_B bang

    Well (s)aid Wade. :-)

    They used to send “advocacy kids” to vocational/tech schools, but now they are just warehoused until they drop out or get a worthless diploma. Sad really, but we can do better if we first acknowledge that something is wrong.

    Sep 29, 2007 at 2:30 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #135   Juliet bang

    I think teaching is a job you have to do to fully appreciate what goes on in a classroom. Like in any profession, there are good and bad teachers.

    Bear with me… it is my belief that if you want to eat in a restaurant you should have to work in one for at least a week. That way you are more likely to be compassionate when you eat at an understaffed restaurant and it takes your server 30 min. to come and even say hello. I have seen many cases of ‘restaurant rage’ where someone who has never done the job thinks that their server should possess magical powers for minimum wage and possibly tips (depending of course on just how magical the servers are) and should get their coffee or order ‘right now’. “Why is my order taking so long? What do you mean it has to *cook*? This is a restaurant! I want it now!”
    Please, before writing back with stories of terrible service, remember that I am talking about the behaviour of customers, not the servers. Everyone here has had good service and bad service. And I’m sure everyone has seen someone spaz on a server irrationally. Just like everyone here has had good and bad teachers. This post isn’t to do with the teachers, it’s to do with the customers.

    I think that to fully appreciate the job of teaching everyone should have to experience it. Then if you still think teachers are lazy, fine. You couldn’t pay me enough to teach. You have all sorts of unpaid extra-curricular activities to run and you take your work home with you. I’ve had to meet with parents and that often isn’t fun. I’m glad there are people who want to do the job – no thanks!

    Sep 29, 2007 at 5:16 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #136   Canthz_B bang

    I agree that anyone willing to work hard on behalf of our childrens’ well-being for a 180 day school year, get 8 to 10 weeks off in the summer and receive a full year’s wage is more than welcome to it. I sure would not be up to it.

    Sep 29, 2007 at 7:08 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #137   Scooter

    I think this note is code for some plan to commit mass genocide on the school population.

    Sep 30, 2007 at 12:29 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #138   BoggyWoggy

    Wow, Juliet, well-said.
    As a passionate educator, I have never given up on my students. I have an entire notebook filled with amazing stories of kids and families I’ve worked with over the years…things that most people cannot believe (like the mom who washed he daughter’s hair with industrial-strength Lysol, thinking it would kill the head lice. Instead, the kid ended up on life-support!) I have been in the classroom for 21 years, teaching all grades (K-8) and all abilities (Learning Disabled-through-TAG), and am now an ESL teacher and “Literacy Coach” for a Core Knowledge school. Whenever I hear anyone commenting on teacher pay, I cringe. AFter 21 years of non-stop service, I finally hit the $50,000 this year…and am still paying off student loans for degrees and endorsements. I’d love for more folks to have to spend time sitting in a hallway or classroom, just observing. I bet most would go home with a bad headache and a stronger love for their own children…

    Sep 30, 2007 at 12:53 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #139   Canthz_B bang

    Boggy, I am sure you are among the finest educators we have. I am grateful for you and those like you.
    My wife and I did, spend classroom time…the teacher fell asleep while reading to the kids on our third day there.
    We had a visit with an assistant principal during which children were wandering the halls unsupervised. I’m sure they were supposed to be somewhere, but they were just wandering about.
    No one seemed to care.
    While I am sure that you do care a great deal, I can only speak from my experience with my own children’s’ schools. I know in my heart that there are many better schools around…but that is not where my kids were.
    I have been paying the health care bills for really sick folks for well over 20 years taking away one small worry from their lives while they deal with trying to hold on to life itself and have not yet reached $50K…We need to get paid for our caring and service too.
    CEOs with golden parachutes ought to be shot from the skies!
    Again I say, you good teachers deserve to be rewarded for your devotion to our young people.

    Sep 30, 2007 at 2:40 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #140   Juliet bang

    The teacher fell asleep??? Yikes! That ain’t cool. I hope it was due to a medical reason.

    I didn’t know teachers got a full year’s pay. I don’t think they do where I live. As an SEA I never did, and had to find employment for the summer. It was never adequate. And Christmas sucked. I was broke at the worst time of year.

    Sep 30, 2007 at 3:14 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #141   Canthz_B bang

    I can only speak for my State of New Jersey.
    Our teaches AVERAGE well over $50K. To anyoune who makes $40K for working 50 weeks, that would be considered a full year’s pay.
    Add in the week after Chrismas off, a week in the Spring off (all paid) and the other holiday and in-service days that teachers get paid for and do not work, and you can see how some may see griping over teacher pay as too much to take for too few results.
    Yes, she fell asleep. The first day we attended her class she told the kids it was story-time. One little unruly boy piped up “We’ve never had story-time before!”
    Well, she started to read the book, but by day three her body clock caught up with her and she could no longer keep up the charade.

    I lost three days pay to see that my child’s school was not performing or her. There was no need to take a 4th day off, I had seen enough!

    Sep 30, 2007 at 3:27 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #142   Canthz_B bang

    “…not performing ‘for’ her..” last paragragh of my last post

    Sep 30, 2007 at 3:31 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #143   Canthz_B bang

    Screw the paragraph misspelling…you get it, right? :-)

    Sep 30, 2007 at 3:32 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #144   Canthz_B bang

    I admit to not knowing just how payment is dispersed, that is, whether the checks come regularly or just during the school months, but how one manages an adequate amount of pay is up to the individual. Over $1,000.00 per week should more than sustain one.

    Sep 30, 2007 at 3:39 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #145   Canthz_B bang

    And let us not forget tenure, A system by which, after a set number of years, it is almost impossible to loose one’s job.
    Boy, how many of us would kill for that little perk?

    Sep 30, 2007 at 3:49 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #146   Canthz_B bang

    There has been much talk that the job of an educator is difficult and that if one is not an educator one cannot understand. Many of the same voices ask for higher pay.
    Most will agree that the task is an arduous one.
    Would higher pay make the chosen career of educator less difficult? Or would the task remain the same?

    Sep 30, 2007 at 4:32 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #147   PS


    The problem is that based on your terrible experience, you have made sweeping and cruel generalizations about all schools and teachers. Yes, your child’s school is a disgrace. No, that doesn’t mean all schools and teachers are terrible.

    Oh, and don’t present things as fact when they are not.

    In my opinion, your tactics in these comments are despicable. Open your mind a bit.

    Sep 30, 2007 at 4:35 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #148   Canthz_B bang

    My mind is open. As I have said I only speak from my own experiences and do not generalize.
    I am looking for solutions, not problems…we already have the problems.
    You think I make this shit up?!
    Why are you so closed and fixated n me personally that you cannot see that?

    Sep 30, 2007 at 4:46 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #149   normal

    According to my handy "find" function, Canthz_B has posted 25 posts in this thread alone.  Which would be, oh, 1/6 of all posts in this thread.

    For the love of all that is good and holy, Canthz_B, can you not post COMBINATIONS OF MULTIPLE THOUGHTS IN SINGLE POSTS?

    Just a suggestion.

    Sep 30, 2007 at 4:48 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #150   normal

    Well, while I was typing, you made that 126.

    Sep 30, 2007 at 4:49 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #151   Canthz_B bang

    PS, you accuse me of stating facts which are not facts but do not specify that with which you dispute…your tactics…?

    Sep 30, 2007 at 4:49 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #152   Canthz_B bang

    Normal, no I cannot.

    Sep 30, 2007 at 4:51 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #153   Canthz_B bang

    Multiple thoughts should not be combined…they are separate thoughts.

    Sep 30, 2007 at 4:53 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #154   Canthz_B bang


    Sep 30, 2007 at 5:01 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #155   Zelanie bang

    Our rate of pay is based upon the number of days in our contract.  If we work more days, we get paid more.  Most teachers that I know spend their summers either taking classes to fulfill new district requirements, working, or both.  We are not paid for summers unless we work them.

    Other fields where most employees have a master's degree and work all year do have higher pay scales, I believe.  Also, keep in mind that during the school year we are often working 12-hour days.  Most of my workweeks average 60 hours, but I am paid for 40.

    I am sorry that you had a bad experience with your child's school.  Most of the teachers I know out here work themselves to the bone and are barely getting by.  I've only been working for a few years, and I've had to deal with such fun things as a parent going through heroin withdrawal *in* the classroom, children in foster care or in hiding from an abusive parent, children with undiagnosed autism, etc.  For some of those kids, it's really a miracle that they even make it to school.  Maslow's hierarchy shows why they aren't able to devote most of their attention to learning.

    You cite the "tenure" system where it's difficult to fire experienced, but bad, teachers.  I think we all know a few teachers who should not be in the classroom.  However, those rules exist to protect teachers from the whims of an arbitrary or incompetent administrator, who often has a lot of power and little oversight.  To solve the problem of not being able to fire incompetent teachers, the administrator issue would need to be addressed in some way first.

    You're right, parents *should* take care of many issues at home.  However, particularly (but not necessarily) in low-income households, many don't.  So, we do the best we can with what we have.

    Most of the people who sound the alarm about failing public schools are people who want the public education system to fail.  There are people who don't believe in a free public education, and they perpetuate the myth that we're just "throwing money" at a problem.  If you look at the level of service that kids get in most schools vs. the level of need that exists, you should quickly see where more money could be very helpful.

    A big chunk of school funding these days is going to health care.  If we were able to fix the health care system (and *not* by dropping or limiting coverage), then more money might be available to go directly into the classroom.

    There are problems in the public school system.  However, I don't feel that people who aren't working to make things better have a lot of ground to complain about those of us who are.  You're just perpetuating a myth fed to you by some rich activists who don't want to pay for other kids' education.

    Sep 30, 2007 at 5:08 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #156   Canthz_B bang

    Besides, I am here for the laughter generated by so many minds with such differing viewpoints.
    I am also here for the free give and take of ideas.
    If you chose to count posts rather than address the ideas contained within, well, isn't that on you?

    Sep 30, 2007 at 5:36 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #157   Zsa

    Ok, I have to pipe in now. Canthz, its pretty obvious you werent the one home-schooling your kids.  Its a lot of work, and I'll bet your wife spent more than 6 hours a day, 50 weeks a year planning, organizing, finding interesting material and actually teaching your kids.  Now multiply that by 15.
    My Mom was a teacher (retired now- ending salary after 33 years teaching- $52k) and I know first hand that all those "days not working" is your skewed perception. She was working, she certianly wasnt home with us.  The administrator meetings, training sessions and report card writing on those days always made her say she would have rather had a day with the kids high on sugar.
    She spent at least a month of summer planning and reorganizing (if not moving) her classroom. Plus hours of administrative meetings to approve her cirruculum. She was one that left by 4pm, she was a single mom to 3 of us, but that meant she had at least an hour of grading/planning to do while we did our homework.
    Do you have to bring your work home to keep up?  I dont, I make way more than $52k, and none of my employees expect me to wipe noses, open their lunches or referee fist-fights.
    So please shut up about this- your biases are showing and its not pretty.

    Sep 30, 2007 at 5:40 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #158   No Brainer

    It sounds like Canthiz_B is saying that the schools are broken. Isn't that what the politicians say too?

    Sep 30, 2007 at 5:45 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #159   Canthz_B bang

    Now THAT'S a free exchange of information!
    I don't mind paying for the public education system…I was raised in that system and supported it with my tax dollars even when my own did not benefit directly from it. Where did that come from? For the record I stand fully behind public education! I do not believe that remaining silent about or making excuses for poor public education benefits our children or our society as a whole.
    Again, again, again…I applaud the very many hard working educators out there…I just wish they would stop saying that there are only a few who are not very fine.
    I do not speak, and have not spoken to ALL districts or their policies. PLEASE read the posts.
    I don't live where you live and will not address the teacher contracts (if they exist) there. What right would I have to do that?

    Sep 30, 2007 at 8:05 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #160   Canthz_B bang

    Zsa, yes I bring my work home, need to keep up with the new Gov. Regs, too.
    As I said way way earlier, parents need to do the proper home training of their kids before handing them out into the world, that includes openning lunch and wiping one's own nose (butt too!) so those have never been things we expected of our kids' teachers.

    Mine are free of the schools but there are others depending upon those schools.
    I don't have an axe to grind or a bias, just a true life experience to relate.
    Dislike of that lived truth does not make it not a truth.
    And, no I was not the one home-schooling my children…we worked as a team, husband, wife and children.
    Sorry to have values.

    Sep 30, 2007 at 8:18 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #161   Canthz_B bang

    Zsa, I never said home-schooling was easy…we just needed to do what was right for us so we did it. I never said it was right or even desireable for everyone…the constant I have tried, perhaps failed get acreoss is stop making excuses for failed parents/schools/students and get about the work of fixing things.
    This will require the work of parents, teachers and students…together.
    We home schooled because we had no one to work with…that's not everyone's experience.

    Sep 30, 2007 at 8:31 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #162   Team Cassandra bang


    Terry – don't you love us anymore? We still love you. How about a new note?

    peace and blessings,
    Team Cassandra.

    Sep 30, 2007 at 8:54 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #163   Team Cassandra bang

    And in other news:


    I could not be happier:)

    Sep 30, 2007 at 8:55 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #164   WanderingPenguin bang

    Well, I would have waited for another thread, but there is no other thread….yet…. and I wanted to respond to Wade re #135. Sorry to lie twice in one weekend!

    You know, Wade, I almost said exactly the same thing here – that you didn't really elect him the first time – but I didn't think it would go over well since I am speaking as an outsider. :) Thanks for putting it out there and watching my back!

    Hey – loving these new comment boxes! Woo hoo! Beats typing "<b></b>" all the time!

    I wonder how many more paragraphs I can end with an exclamation point?!

    Oh and one last thing about me "correcting" people: there is usually at least one error of a grammatical, spelling or punctuation kind in over 90% of the posts on here – mine included – and pointing them out would amount to a full-time job. I restrict myself (through a great gnashing of teeth) to either posts which are correcting other posts and contain errors while doing so (I love when that happens) or asking for clarification of what I take to be an error that makes it hard to follow the point of the post or undersells a reference to a previous comment made. That will likely continue, like it or lump it, and it probably makes me sound like a blowhard but really, I have reached a point where I don't give a rat's ass. Just putting that out there. I think by now you will have noticed that, unlike a couple of other participants in here (very few, though), when I am in the wrong, I very quickly apologize for it instead of making excuses or slinging insults. Oops, I almost forgot the exclamation point!

    Gee, I sure hope there is a new thread here soon, before we reach 200 comments!

    Sep 30, 2007 at 8:57 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #165   Team Cassandra bang

    Dear Terry,

    Do you no longer love us? We still love you:)

    How about a new note?

    peace and blessings,
    Team Cassandra

    Sep 30, 2007 at 8:57 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #166   spiderflowers

    Alright I am getting into this now!  I home school my kids, who are 4, 6, and 8.  My son read the Lord of the Rings series at age 6.  In 4 days.  The whole thing.  And he understood it all.  I am not joking.  His friend from across the road, who has a good family, with lots of love and support, can't even read The Cat in the Hat, at 9 years old.  That is how bad the school system in Franklin County, Kansas is.  I am not even mentioning the mold problems in the elementary schools.  Or the fact that that county has a humongous teen pregnancy problem.  It is common even for girls under 13 to pregnant.   (I just moved to another state last week, thankfully.)
    I spend a ton of time homeschooling my kids, but not 6 hours a day!  No need, when they are like little sponges.  But homeschooling is definitely a way of life, not some easy undertaking. 

    And you are correct that teachers are underpaid and underappreciated, of course.  Like nurses.  But way too often the teachers hate kids!  They teach because they got fired or something from their other job and had no other choice.  As with everything, those few jerks out there in your child's school can make a huge difference in his/her life. 

    I forgot my point now that I am fired up about the public school system, dammit!  Oh now I remember…
    Team homeschool, all the way!

    Oh, yeah, can someone explain who is Kerry?  Or Terry?  And Anthony Hall?  And Rene someone or other?  I missed something somewhere.

    Sep 30, 2007 at 9:01 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #167   spiderflowers

    Okay I typed a post, hit send and it disappeared somewhere.  So, to recap:

    Go team homeschool!
    And go team great teachers!  Though there are a ton of crappy ones out there.

    Who is Anthony Grosso?  Rene someone?  And this is stupid of me, but who is Terry and Kerry?  Sorry, don't laugh, I am not a moron!

    Sep 30, 2007 at 9:09 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #168   GVI bang

    I was thinking the very same thing T_C.

    Sep 30, 2007 at 9:17 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #169   BoggyWoggy

    MY rate of pay…this should be interesting, is based on the days I work. Here's a mini-breakdown:
    Contract: 180 days
    Pay: $41,000
    Experience: 21 years.
    Classroom description: 32 4th ad 5th graders: 9 native languages, 13 IEPs for severe learning disabilities, 85% poverty, 11 girls/21 boys, classroom budget of $600 to cover all expenses (printing, supplies, etc., which is less than $20/child for the entire year. Anything I spend beyond that comes from my own pocket…last year was $2100), hours worked per week on average: 55.

    Per day average pay: Well, $41,000/180= $228. With 32 students, that means I am earning $7.12 per student per hour. Consider that daycare was $12/hour for each of my 2 children for quality care ($24/hour).

    I'm not bitching…I love what I do…and 99% of teachers do, as well, but I HATE bitching folks who do nothing to make changes, but just bitch! Instead, set up a PAC and march on your state capital and make sure your state has strict guidelines for hiring teachers. NCLB isn't all bad…I like that there are now minimun qualifications for teachers, but good grief! If there is a teacher who is sleeping in your child's school and you haven't goen before the school board, demanding an explanation, then you are part of the problem!

    Sep 30, 2007 at 9:35 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #170   Canthz_B bang

    Team new note! :-)

    Sep 30, 2007 at 9:35 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #171   Canthz_B bang

    Boggy, I understand.
    You should not have to provide school supplies for the schools. That is just wrong. As I have said I do not know all areas of the world, but in my State in the USA the teachers' unions would NEVER allow such a thing to happen. Parents would be required to purchase supplies for their children before any school employee would. In fact they are to a good extent from what I read about back-to school costs last month. NJ parents are buying school supplies that the school once provided.
    You did, however, disclose your overhead expeneses in your breakdown but forgot, and I am sure honestly,  to do the same for the daycare providers.
    I mean, they change diapers!…Eeewwww! :-)

    Sep 30, 2007 at 11:32 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #172   Canthz_B bang

    Given Boggy's math, based upon student rather than the $28.50 per hour it comes out to…If she gets $7.12 per hour for each student who's parent makes $12.12 per hour then the parent makes $5.00 per hour.
    Well, we all know that that is not true!!! The logic, though beautifully framed, is flawed.
    Do the math.

    Sep 30, 2007 at 11:42 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #173   Canthz_B bang

    I thinks she means $7.12 per day per clild.

    Oct 1, 2007 at 12:28 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #174   Canthz_B bang

    I agree Boggy! When we had the sleepy teacher thing we complained all of the way up the ladder!
    Didn't get anywhere…but we complained!
    She had tenure.

    Oct 1, 2007 at 12:33 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #175   claw71

    I think teachers are similar to cops. You have some who are absolutely fantastic and some who are so reprehensible that it's criminal. Most, however are mediocre work-a-day hacks who are just trying to get through the week.

    There are two problems. One is that we are tricked into holding both cops and teachers out as heroes. The reality couldn't be further from the truth. That doesn't make them bad. What makes cops and teachers bad is the fact that they cover for each other. So weeding out the corrupt, incompetent and ineffective becomes impossible.

    In theory, when performing at their highest levels, teachers and cops deserve more money but in reality nobody can afford to pay them that much. The problem is that cops and teachers know that going in.  It's unfair to turn around and bitch about it 10 years into a career.

    And teachers are paid quite well based on hours worked. The average yearly salary for teachers is just under $50, 000 per year. Let's keep in mind that teachers generally work about 2/3 the hours that the rest of us do.  Especially since they promoted me to burger flipper.

    Oct 1, 2007 at 10:33 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #176   Lurker

    Hey, it just occurred to me that maybe the problem in the hallways during lunch is something as simple as the smell from the kitchen! :)

    Oct 1, 2007 at 6:06 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #177   BoggyWoggy

    Yes…per day. Let's see:
    32 students X $7.12 = $227.84
    That makes more sense…however, I'd LOVE to earn the per hour figure! Can you imagine!? Oh, and daycare providers do not supply the diapers…moms do.

    Oct 1, 2007 at 7:09 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #178   Shannon

    I’m jumping into this one a little late, but I’m a public school teacher, so I figured I’d give a few statistics in my life….

    1. I work from about 7:15 a.m to about 6 or 7 at night. I get paid for the hours between 7:15 and 2:31. I do not get paid for the hour (2:30-3:30) that I stay every night to help students with their homework and other assignments. I also spend every Sunday planning/ correcting papers….no….I don’t get paid for Sunday either. (whoever said teachers work “2/3 the rest of us do” is nuts…sorry). Also, this year, I will take home about $36,000. And no I’m not complaining, as someone else said, teachers know what they are getting into and I love my job a great deal….I’m just offering a fact.

    2. I am not legally allowed to ask a child to bring anything to my room other than themselves. So therefore, I’ve spent about $200 of my own money (so far this year….and it’s only October) buying pencils, pens, paper, notecards, highlighters, folders, and other things that students don’t come with. Not a day goes by when I’m not handing out supplies because children show up at my door empty handed and we both have to do our best to achieve learning.

    3. I have broken up fights, I have comforted children coming to school who have been kicked out of their homes, suffered the death of a family member, found out about they were pregnant, are homeless. I have comforted the “big” dramas of breaking up with boyfriends/girlfriends or having a fight with a best friend. I take some of them home at night, I have lost a few to gangs and violence and I have others that I fear I will lose again.

    4. I have dealt with parents that are so drugged up/drunk/etc that they have no clue what their child is doing. I have had the phrase, “They’re yours between 8:00 & 3:00…not my problem!” thrown in my face more than I care to mention. I spend a good part of my day teaching citizenship and kindness to kid who clearly don’t get it anywhere else. Should parents be teaching the kids at home? Yes…but the fact remains they don’t.

    I love my job a great deal and it makes me sad to know that no matter how hard I bust my ass every day, people will still talk about all teachers like they are “bad teachers” and will still talk about how all schools are crappy, they could do a better job, etc.

    Here’s a novel idea from a teacher: GET INVOLVED IN YOUR CHILD’S SCHOOL! In any way possible. Don’t just sit and complain, find out what you can do to help.

    Oct 3, 2007 at 12:21 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #179   Canthz_B bang

    We would all lke to make that per hour figure! And not have to change crappy diapers, no matter who provided the clean ones.

    Oct 7, 2007 at 10:14 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #180   Canthz_B bang

    2/3 is a good point claw. A few hours on Sundays does not take into account summers off!

    Oct 7, 2007 at 10:18 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #181   Canthz_B bang

    And what the hell does poverty have to do with teaching???? Are poor kids dumber in some way??? Should I give back my earned degree because my mom way poor? Or do you think that some “smart” teacher gave me what I did not receive at home?….STOP PSYCHOANALYZING OUR KIDS AND JUST TEACH THEM
    Fall vacation, one week, winter vacation, one week, spring vacation one week, summer vaccation ten weeks! You don’t even work a full year and quote a yearly salary based on a partial years work? Learn math before you teach it…For shame!

    Oct 7, 2007 at 10:33 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #182   Canthz_B bang

    #182, I feel your pain.
    But not every student comes unprepared to learn. What you spend out of your pocket is altruism and you have no right to complain about it. Keep receipts and charge the school district if you cannot afford it…My best advice is to just not damned do that anymore!!!!

    Oct 7, 2007 at 10:49 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #183   Canthz_B bang

    #182, I don’t believe anyone has said that all teachers or schools are crappy.
    But to make excuses for the bad apples that all can see is frankly silly.
    Blaming parents is the worst excuse of all…some of us were there…you just would not hear us. :-(

    Oct 7, 2007 at 11:24 pm   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #184   Canthz_B bang

    Somewhere, way back up, someone said that it it the responsibility of parents to raise their children, not the public schools.

    Oct 8, 2007 at 12:16 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #185   Canthz_B bang

    Teachers advocates…please take the time to read #114….The target is not on the teachers’ backs here.

    Oct 8, 2007 at 1:31 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #186   Damas

    Canthz, I find it really hard to believe no one had dyslexia or any other developmental or neurological disorder. Maybe they were able to hide it. Or perhaps in the middle ages the parents of such children kept them home to avoid embarrassment. It was the case years ago that such children weren’t even given the opportunity to attend school. Dyslexia is a physical (brain) condition as much as it is mental. In fact, the mental part of it is only the anxiety and depression that comes from trying hard to deal with such a disorder in an unforgiving environment. It is not something acquired due to a lack of discipline or a dislike of study. We can’t all be as blessed as you. “The good Lord chose not to bless me with a fully functioning brain.”

    Aug 3, 2008 at 3:56 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

    • #186.1   Canthz_B bang

      Thank you for acknowledging that your brain is not fully functioning.
      That explains a great deal about why you have failed to understand my point.
      Sure kids were what we would now call “developmentally impaired” and “learning disabled” (cute,non-threatening terms, huh?) but we didn’t upend the educational system to accommodate them to the detriment of all of the non-developmentally impaired students.

      Aug 3, 2008 at 5:10 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

  • #187   Damas

    Her body clock gave out after 3 days!? Mine would too. You do know that inservice days are not free days for teachers as they are for students? Teachers WORK on inservice days. The children do not. You are a dumb ass. It isn’t hard to see your point, because the education system obviously failed you Canthz! Also, if your mind is so open, how come you keep spouting the same ignorant BS post-after-debunked post?

    Aug 3, 2008 at 4:17 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

    • #187.1   Canthz_B bang

      Because nothing was debunked. There is nothing to be debunked. Because you misunderstand my position on the education system, what’s broken and what needs fixing. Because you want to find an enemy, not a solution. Because you addressed one sentence in post #102 as if it were to be taken literally.
      I keep repeating just for retards like you!
      Make sure you make clear that the body clock giving out in three days was in reference to my kid’s teacher falling asleep while reading to the class, and you say it’s because she may have worked an in-service day? That debunks what again?

      Aug 3, 2008 at 5:50 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up

    • #187.2   Canthz_B bang

      The education system did not fail me, Damas. Back in my day it worked well.
      More than I can say for the way things are now.
      But then, you don’t really want to hear that it’s broken, do you?
      Sad really.
      Go on living with your excuses and your head in the sand. My kids are half-way through college now!

      Aug 3, 2008 at 5:57 am   rating: 90  small thumbs up


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