Herbie goes to Washington

August 24th, 2008 · 233 comments

You say you’re politically engaged, but do you know where your candidate stands on…vanity license plates? Are they:

a) a bombastic example of the first amendment in action

b) a potent symbol for the reductive nature of America’s two-party political system

c) unwise at any speed

Still undecided? Take a look at the tags Rachel has on her car in Austin, Texas:

OBAMA

And the note she found recently on her windshield:

Obama sucks!

Meanwhile, in blue-state land…

To the person who stole the "Marriage - One man, one woman" decal from my VW on June 26th: To you "Free Speech" must mean if my opinion disagrees with yours, then I should be silenced. "Tolerance" means my views don't earn the same respect I render to your beliefs. If you have any courage or decency I challenge you to return my property.

Which led to this note posted in the office parking garage, and documented for us by Melissa in Long Beach:

To the person who stole the "Marriage - One man, one woman" decal from my VW on June 26th: To you "Free Speech" must mean if my opinion disagrees with yours, then I should be silenced. "Tolerance" means my views don't earn the same respect I render to your beliefs. If you have any courage or decency I challenge you to return my property.

related: The audacity of theft

extra credit: License plates and the first amendment [nytimes.com]

extra extra credit: Rock the vote!

FILED UNDER: Austin · California · car · Long Beach · parking · politics


233 responses so far ↓

  • #1   snee bang

    dear tony,

    you have a lot of “crap” on your car.

    snee

    Aug 24, 2008 at 11:13 pm   rating: 26  small thumbs up

    • #1.1   Jesus

      I certainly agree.

      Nov 4, 2008 at 10:39 am   rating: 2  small thumbs up

       
     
  • #2   Amber

    told you guys we had some crazy obama fans in tx!

    what what!

    Aug 24, 2008 at 11:13 pm   rating: 4  small thumbs up

    • #2.1   zombieBlanco bang

      ummm,

      apparently some crazy obama haters also!

      Aug 24, 2008 at 11:21 pm   rating: 9  small thumbs up

       
     
  • #3   secondsout bang

    Instead of your “marriage – one, man, one woman” decal, can I replace it with one that reads, “I’m a raging homophobe?” No? Would that be passive-aggressive of me? My bad.

    Interesting that a guy who is advocating for discrimination wants to lecture people about tolerance.

    Aug 24, 2008 at 11:24 pm   rating: 148  small thumbs up

    • #3.1   Canthz_B bang

      I’m with Tony. Those Mormons even tried to get a Presidential nomination this year. They’re getting out of hand, I tell ya!

      Aug 24, 2008 at 11:39 pm   rating: 17  small thumbs up

       
    • #3.2   ihityouinthenose bang

      Tony is a man driving a Volkswagen Beetle with a “Marriage – one man, one woman” decal. A Beetle! He doesn’t need another decal to advertise his homophobia.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 12:56 am   rating: 23  small thumbs up

       
    • #3.3   addict

      but it’s a *turbo* beetle. that makes him a “real man,” right?

      Aug 25, 2008 at 10:12 am   rating: 8  small thumbs up

       
    • #3.4   Nate

      Over 30 thumbs up? I had no idea (wait yes I did) there were so many liberals on this site…

      Aug 25, 2008 at 1:45 pm   rating: 4  small thumbs up

       
    • #3.5   agirlie

      I think the sticker reading “gays should die” would be considered homophobic…not so much the whole marriage debate.

      It does seem tolerance leans one way!

      Aug 25, 2008 at 2:10 pm   rating: 46  small thumbs up

       
    • #3.6   Erika

      Tolerance includes letting people live their lives in peace when they’re not hurting anyone. Those people who refuse marriage equality to gays and lesbians are not tolerant.

      If you don’t like gay marriage, don’t get gay married.

      Aug 26, 2008 at 10:36 pm   rating: 82  small thumbs up

       
    • #3.7   bob jones

      How very tolerant of you, Erika.
      Those people who don’t agree with you have no right whatsoever to their own opinions.
      Thanks for setting the record straight…is it ok if I say straight?

      Aug 26, 2008 at 11:07 pm   rating: 27  small thumbs up

       
    • #3.8   GatorCat

      Are you serious? There’s no “disagreeing.” Banning gay marriage is discrimination, period.

      Aug 26, 2008 at 11:25 pm   rating: 40  small thumbs up

       
    • #3.9   Canthz_B bang

      Thanks for the advice, Erika. I was just about to run out and get gay married and you stopped me!

      Aug 26, 2008 at 11:31 pm   rating: 4  small thumbs up

       
    • #3.10   morpho aurora bang

      yes, banning gay marriage is discriminatory

      so is telling someone they can’t share their opinion

      Aug 26, 2008 at 11:31 pm   rating: 24  small thumbs up

       
     
  • #4   secondsout bang

    Does the magnet decal actually make noise? Otherwise, how would someone “silence” you by stealing it?

    Aug 24, 2008 at 11:27 pm   rating: 30  small thumbs up

    • #4.1   se

      The same way that burning books “silences” the author. the same way that bombing a newspaper office “silences” an opinion. neither of these make noise.
      In 24.1, Canthz_B explains this bumper decal theft to you.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 6:23 pm   rating: 14  small thumbs up

       
    • #4.2   mark

      All my bombing of newspapers and abortion clinics made noise. That is half the fun!!

      Aug 27, 2008 at 1:17 pm   rating: 3  small thumbs up

       
     
  • #5   Mushroom

    Plateframe: “Driver carries no cash – spent it all on this shiny car.”

    Aug 24, 2008 at 11:28 pm   rating: 6  small thumbs up

     
  • #6   Cara

    Didn’t Tony realize its entirely possible that whoever stole the “one woman one man” piece of flair just liked it so much they wanted it for their very own?

    Tony is just feeling sewwww oppressed over this! Poor fucking thing. What a hypocritical asshole.

    Aug 24, 2008 at 11:34 pm   rating: 48  small thumbs up

    • #6.1   Canthz_B bang

      How is he a hypocrite?
      Is he tearing decals espousing views he disagrees with off of people’s cars?

      He says he respects their beliefs, he doesn’t have to agree with them.

      Aug 24, 2008 at 11:49 pm   rating: 43  small thumbs up

       
    • #6.2   me

      How does Tony know it was stolen in the first place? When those things get old, they fall off. How does he know it didn’t fly off somewhere down the road… it’s happened to me, but with my support the troops ribbon.

      Just sayin… chill out and get another one Tony

      Aug 25, 2008 at 10:15 am   rating: 12  small thumbs up

       
    • #6.3   AuntyBron

      THey also can come loose in the carwash when the power sprayer hits them.

      Aug 27, 2008 at 11:27 am   rating: 1  small thumbs up

       
    • #6.4   AuntyBron

      Bugger! It won’t let me edit!

      Aug 27, 2008 at 11:28 am   rating: 0  small thumbs up

       
    • #6.5   mark

      maybe his gay car took it off so that it wouldn’t be embarrassed at it’s gay marriage when it gay married a Prius.

      Aug 27, 2008 at 1:21 pm   rating: 25  small thumbs up

       
    • #6.6   Arne

      That’s why I always buy two identical bumper stickers. Just in case one gets stolen (or my bumper falls off) OR someone else likes it so much I can give them an extra. NO B.O.!

      Oct 16, 2008 at 1:41 pm   rating: 0  small thumbs up

       
     
  • #7   zombieBlanco bang

    If Tony is storing his treasures in Heaven, why is he so worried about his 99¢ decal here on Earth?

    Aug 24, 2008 at 11:35 pm   rating: 78  small thumbs up

    • #7.1   Wade bang

      Maybe because he can’t buy another one, since he carries no cash.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 8:27 am   rating: 8  small thumbs up

       
     
  • #8   Canthz_B bang

    It’s nice to see such ardent God-fearing, all-American patriotism on a German-made car!

    Aug 24, 2008 at 11:35 pm   rating: 57  small thumbs up

    • #8.1   HopefulNebula

      My sister calls them “Nazi bubbles.”

      Aug 24, 2008 at 11:37 pm   rating: 53  small thumbs up

       
    • #8.2   noob

      there seems to be nothing wrong with a bit of good old german bashing.
      Nothing’s changed, fucking nazis. Bomb them back to the renaissance.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 10:10 am   rating: 3  small thumbs up

       
    • #8.3   Kimberly

      I don’t know your sister but I officially love her for that.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 10:16 am   rating: 8  small thumbs up

       
    • #8.4   hamburke

      haha – the VW was actually commissioned by Hitler during WWII and like Mercedes and BMW, they went commercial after the war. I love the phrase Nazi bubble! I’m going to have to use it even though my new fave car is the Passat convertible.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 8:19 pm   rating: 1  small thumbs up

       
     
  • #9   morpho aurora bang

    maybe they were trying to do tony a favor, looks like all those decals are messing up his paint.

    ever notice the people with the most idiot religious stickers on the car are usually the worst drivers?

    Aug 24, 2008 at 11:37 pm   rating: 24  small thumbs up

    • #9.1   Canthz_B bang

      Why else would they need a plastic Jesus on the dashboard?

      Aug 24, 2008 at 11:42 pm   rating: 13  small thumbs up

       
    • #9.2   morpho aurora bang

      the next one who pulls out in front of me and then goes 15 mph is gonna need god as his copilot and that slow ass guardian angel when i shove that bobblehead jesus up his ass.
      :evil:

      Aug 24, 2008 at 11:48 pm   rating: 24  small thumbs up

       
    • #9.3   K Dog

      That’s always been my observation as well. I want to get a bumper sticker that says “Jesus wouldn’t have cut me off” or “Jesus would have let me in.”

      Aug 25, 2008 at 11:12 am   rating: 17  small thumbs up

       
    • #9.4   "Shill"

      Let’s be fair. The cars with the most stickers of any kind (including the ever-popular anti-Bush ones) have the worst drivers. Subject matter can’t make a raving lunatic sane.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 4:33 pm   rating: 22  small thumbs up

       
    • #9.5   Stitchin-Liz

      True dat! Also, any check with a religious symbol or phrase on it is guaranteed to bounce. When I worked in order processing we were told to bring any such checks directly to the manager.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 6:54 pm   rating: 8  small thumbs up

       
    • #9.6   mark

      You ever notice how our bigotry causes us to misjudge people.

      Aug 27, 2008 at 1:22 pm   rating: 4  small thumbs up

       
    • #9.7   Arne

      Yeah… I used to work at a camp. Some poor kids dad drove up in a “wood” paneled station wagon w/ sooo many religious stickers all over the back windows. He gets out and he’s this neanderthal looking guy w/ 4 days stubble, a dirty wife beater, gut over the belt and a cigar stub hanging out of his mouth. Classic!

      Oct 16, 2008 at 1:46 pm   rating: 0  small thumbs up

       
     
  • #10   Canthz_B bang

    I think the plate in #1 is being misinterpreted.

    It’s short for: Obstetrician – American Medical Association.

    Aug 24, 2008 at 11:41 pm   rating: 18  small thumbs up

    • #10.1   agirlie

      or
      Over
      Beach
      And
      Mountain
      Anglers

      ??

      Aug 25, 2008 at 2:12 pm   rating: 3  small thumbs up

       
     
  • #11   Maddy

    People! What can you do with them!
    Cheers

    Aug 24, 2008 at 11:46 pm   rating: 0  small thumbs up

    • #11.1   morpho aurora bang

      well, if you’ve got ketchup handy…

      Aug 25, 2008 at 1:00 am   rating: 17  small thumbs up

       
     
  • #12   Silliyak

    Jonnie says you can make a hat, a broach, a terydactyl…

    Aug 25, 2008 at 12:07 am   rating: 7  small thumbs up

    • #12.1   Crash bang

      And that you can steal random ass shit if you support gay marriage… GO USA !!

      Aug 25, 2008 at 1:13 am   rating: 12  small thumbs up

       
    • #12.2   Arne

      don’t forget soap and a lampshade..

      Oct 16, 2008 at 1:49 pm   rating: 0  small thumbs up

       
     
  • #13   random bob

    The thing with flaunting views of oppression: Aren’t they sort of, by definition, AGAINST the ideology of tolerance? So then, isn’t his claim about him being tolerant sort of… misplaced?

    I love how they can try to push an agenda of INTOLERANCE and then complain about INTOLERANCE.

    That’s the hypocrisy of it, for those of you above that don’t (didn’t) get it.

    Aug 25, 2008 at 12:09 am   rating: 63  small thumbs up

    • #13.1   Canthz_B bang

      No. Disagreement is not intolerance or oppression.
      I can disagree with a lot of things that I tolerate.
      You disagree with Tony’s point of view and label him as intolerant because he feels a certain way about marriage and you may not feel the same way…I don’t see you as very tolerant of Tony’s point of view.
      It’s not like he advocated any violent actions be taken in support of his view.

      Now who’s the hypocrite?

      The fact is that your point of view is exactly what Tony talks about in his letter. “free speech only if my speech arees with your ponit of view, otherwise you say I’m oppressing you”

      Aug 25, 2008 at 12:16 am   rating: 48  small thumbs up

       
    • #13.2   random bob

      yeah, sorry, but if you’re of the view that PREVENTS a people from having rights, then by definition that’s INTOLERANCE. If you had your way (which largely right now you do), then a lot of people don’t have an opportunity. YOU are directly affecting their tangible rights, whereas in contrast, if they had THEIR way and got married, it doesn’t tangibly affect your rights whatsoever.

      gay marriage (does not equal) no more normal marriage.

      One way is tolerant of both, the other is INTOLERANT.

      Tony = INTOLERANT.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 12:21 am   rating: 71  small thumbs up

       
    • #13.3   shane

      echo CB – disagreement with a view does not equal intolerance.

      Besides, gay men can marry all they want. I’m sure they can find some nice girl to settle down with. :-D

      Aug 25, 2008 at 12:26 am   rating: 13  small thumbs up

       
    • #13.4   Canthz_B bang

      You’re going to tell ME about OPPRESSION! HA!!!

      The person who took his decal was wrong and did it just because they were intolerant of his opinion.
      I don’t like Confederate flag license plates. I find them to be billboards of intolerance. I have no right to skulk about, screw-driver in hand, removing them.
      I can disagree with the person with the plates and still tolerate and respect his right to be the way he is.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 12:39 am   rating: 28  small thumbs up

       
    • #13.5   morpho aurora bang

      not allowing someone to express an intolerant view is showing a lack of tolerance too

      i have enough trouble worrying about who i’m marrying, i don’t care who anyone else marries.

      if we are gonna do teams, i’d like
      team myofb
      and
      team keep your damn hands off other people’s stuff

      Aug 25, 2008 at 12:43 am   rating: 22  small thumbs up

       
    • #13.6   BurstingAtTheSeams

      I agree with Canthz_B.

      However, if you’ve got severely left-wing or right-wing views, people will always say you’re intolerent when you express your beliefs. It’s unfortunate, but you can also count on your stuff getting defaced.

      Worse yet, you may incite some kind of road rage that you’re completely unaware of until somebody intentionally rear ends you!

      Aug 25, 2008 at 2:01 am   rating: 8  small thumbs up

       
    • #13.7   kmd

      Oh, the lulz of car communication and the reactions thereto.

      I have 2 decals on the back of my car. Jesus fish, Darwin fish, kissing. With a little heart over them and everything. Cuz, you know, religion and science? Not really opposites, people. (And yes I mean you, Richard Dawkins. And you, Pat Robertson.)

      A friend has the same 2 decals on the back of her car. She lives in New Mexico. She reports that on numerous occasions some VERY TOLERANT person has ripped the Darwin fish off of her car, leaving only the decal of the Prince of Peace.

      Ennyhoo, I was driving down the highway with the top down, and someone was yelling from another car. Yelling at the top of his lungs. Couldn’t hear him until he hit just the right spot as he passed me and then I finally heard “CHOOSE JESUS!” Hee. Yeah, ok. I’m right there with ya, guy.

      Well, it’s good for the lulz.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 8:17 am   rating: 21  small thumbs up

       
    • #13.8   unholyghost2003 bang

      Random Bob,
      Ummm have you NEVER seen South Park? Try “The Death Camp of Tolerance” the difference between ‘TOLERANCE’ and ‘ACCEPTANCE’ is explained very clearly, and with CARTOONS!

      Aug 25, 2008 at 8:32 am   rating: 10  small thumbs up

       
    • #13.9   Goldie

      Kmd, love this idea about the two fishies. I’ve got to try that one myself!

      Also, people better not rip shit off my car. The poor vehicle is in its golden years where any unexpected physical contact can cause it to suddenly stop working.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 9:18 am   rating: 4  small thumbs up

       
    • #13.10   hamburke

      I want a 2 fishies too! I think that living in one of the most “traditional” Catholic Diocese in the US and being Catholic might just throw a few Knights of Columbus into a tizzy after Mass just before their kid wrecks my car trying to take it off.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 8:33 pm   rating: 3  small thumbs up

       
    • #13.11   Kalakalot

      “The person who took his decal was wrong and did it just because they were intolerant of his opinion.”

      I guess this means the person who stole my “Wrangler butts drive me nuts!” decal wasn’t just a bog-standard thief but a cruel oppressor quashing my right to free speech. I demand that you respect and honor my choice to express admiration for tight butts, dammit!

      Sep 2, 2008 at 5:54 pm   rating: 6  small thumbs up

       
    • #13.12   Canthz_B bang

      You have the right to express any vapid, lacking in redeeming social value opinion you may hold. :roll:

      Sep 2, 2008 at 6:14 pm   rating: 6  small thumbs up

       
    • #13.13   Arne

      wow.. I hope I see your car in the parking lot some day. I’d like to have me a nice kissy fish ornament on the back of my car thank you very much…

      Oct 16, 2008 at 1:58 pm   rating: 0  small thumbs up

       
     
  • #14   Miss Unloop

    homophobist decal = respect + tolerance?

    I don’t think so…

    Aug 25, 2008 at 12:13 am   rating: 32  small thumbs up

    • #14.1   shane

      Nothing on the decal said Tony feared homosexuals.

      Tolerance and disagreement with other views are not the same as CB so eloquently put it above.

      I can disagree with your narrow minded and not-well thought out opinion, but still tolerate it.

      Go TEAM STRNTH!!

      Aug 25, 2008 at 12:23 am   rating: 22  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.2   Miss Unloop

      I do NOT, however, agree with removing anything from anyone’s property – I don’t advocate theft under any circumstances.

      Luv ya, CB! ;)

      Aug 25, 2008 at 12:25 am   rating: 12  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.3   Miss Unloop

      If I had only known that making fun of passive-aggressive notes was to become an issue of semantics…

      Aug 25, 2008 at 12:29 am   rating: 3  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.4   Canthz_B bang

      He can have an anti-gay marriage opinion and still respect the rights of others to have differing opinions and in fact respect their right to an opinion.

      Why does someone need to be portrayed as a uni-browed Neanderthal if they don’t agree with the far-left agenda? In fact, Tony did no name calling whatsoever in his rather peaceful note. He said nothing to indicate that he is a homophobe even. He may have been referring to polygamy.

      Face facts, the person who took his decal had as much right to do so as Tony has to take a pro-gay marriage decal off of someones car…none.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 12:31 am   rating: 28  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.5   Canthz_B bang

      Random Bob,

      1) gays are not “a people”.

      2) gays are saying they need to be allowed to marry for the legal protections marriage affords.

      3) whenever a state legislature proposes Civil Unions which will give the same legal protections as marriage, the gays go bat-shit and want marriage not civil unions.

      Question: if it’s about rights and legal protections why not accept Civil Unions?
      Answer: Because it’s all about being able to smile a little smile and say “we’re married”.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 12:52 am   rating: 21  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.6   ihityouinthenose bang

      and why shouldn’t the gay couple have the same right to be happy to say “we’re married” as a straight couple would. a civil union is a legal bond that can potentially achieve the same legal protections as marriage, but some people seek something higher than legal bonds to one another.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 1:13 am   rating: 38  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.7   Canthz_B bang

      They can be happy and say whatever they want. I know straight couples that aren’t married and introduce themselves as husband and wife.
      You coyly say “that can potentially achieve…” when you know that it’s a simple matter to write a law that makes it clear that there are to be no legal distinctions between marriage and civil union.
      I don’t know what higher thing you may be referring to, but if you mean recognition from on high, I think the Almighty recognizes love when he sees it without a marriage certificate.
      You don’t need a piece of paper with a special word to find something higher if you’re really in love.
      I didn’t love my wife any more deeply after we got married.

      Wait until these marriages and civil unions dissolve and support payments start being adjudicated!
      Gays have it made now. Why would they want to fuck it all up?

      Aug 25, 2008 at 1:23 am   rating: 15  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.8   ihityouinthenose bang

      What you mistake as coyness is simply the extent of a fact. Why should a gay person need to obtain a civil union when a marriage will do just fine? At the moment, neither of these options is fully available to all people. Why should gay people strive to achieve your idea of civil rights over their own?
      Just to clarify, I wasn’t proposing that marriage will bring recognition from any particular god. Not all people have that belief. For some, marriage can offer a connection to another person that has absolutely nothing to do with legal obligations or religion. “The Almighty” doesn’t have to be a part of everyone’s spirituality.
      “Gays have it made now. Why would they want to fuck it all up?” I think I can just let the ignorance of that comment speak for itself.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 1:43 am   rating: 34  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.9   Canthz_B bang

      You obviously cannot tell that the last comment was a joke. Sorry you didn’t get it. :-(

      Anyone who feels closer to the one they love because of a ceremony is not really very close to that other person…straight or gay.

      Scroll down for further information on the social significance of marriage vs civil unions to answer that part of your comment.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 2:15 am   rating: 10  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.10   ihityouinthenose bang

      Some jokes aren’t funny. Yours was ignorant. I’m sorry that you can’t manage to understand that.

      Marriage can be achieved without ceremony, although I think it can be argued that many are in it for the ceremony. If you feel that marriage does nothing for a relationship, I have to ask…why do it at all? I am certain that you have your own reason that differ from mine.

      I do know of the historical social significance of marriage. The keyword there was “historical” of course. Marriage has a different significance world wide and it has changed over time. Ask someone “Why did you get married?”…..do you honestly think the husband will respond “So the rest of society knows this woman is my property and the children she bears are a product of me”? Would that be your own answer? I would think that the word “love” should be somewhere in the response…

      Aug 25, 2008 at 2:51 am   rating: 29  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.11   Canthz_B bang

      I agree that love is the major component, as I stated above.
      If you ask most men why they got married, you’d probably get a lot of “So I wouldn’t lose her” answers. That does not mean that they weren’t in love. So yes, men marry so that other men know that this woman is taken, please don’t hit on her. The ring is a public display of this.
      In fact, when I see an attractive woman, the first thing I do is check her ring finger.

      As for jokes being ignorant, many of them are. Having a sense of humor is the ability to tell when someone believes something ignorant and when they’re just playing with an ignorant idea.
      I mean, I think your choice of name here (I hit you in the nose) is ignorant, not funny, but I didn’t comment on it because it really doesn’t matter.
      Luckily, I’m not into what critics say, so your opinion about my joke is of no consequence to me, otherwise my feelings would have been hurt. :-)

      Aug 25, 2008 at 5:54 am   rating: 7  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.12   unholyghost2003 bang

      ihityouinthenose,
      “a civil union is a legal bond that can potentially achieve the same legal protections as marriage, but some people seek something higher than legal bonds to one another.” REALLY? Then I fail to see the issue with Civil Union. As the laws currently stand there the laws can not, do not, and have not stopped ANYONE from having a religious or spiritual ceremony to unite them with their chosen partner in the eyes of GOD or any higher power of their choosing. If they “seek something higher than legal bonds to one another” they should go out and get it! Do it today! There are Priests and Pastors, Rabbis and and religious leaders of all kinds in every state in the union happy to unite a loving couple no matter the sexes involved. So if this is all about a higher level of union and not legal rights … we already have that! PROBLEM SOLVED! Nothing more to do here!

      Aug 25, 2008 at 9:07 am   rating: 7  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.13   ihityouinthenose bang

      You’re still assuming that all people are religious and believe in a higher power. Likewise, it is possible to be spiritual without believing in a god of any sort.

      Anyway, the point is that not all marriages are treated equally. A straight marriage is recognized by religion, the state, and society. A gay marriage conducted by an accepting religious unit might be accepted by society (though certainly not wholly as certain people on this board have made clear), but it is not recognized by the state. Why should a gay couple need to go through those extra steps of civil union when an institution already exists for their purposes?

      Aug 25, 2008 at 3:11 pm   rating: 15  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.14   Canthz_B bang

      In my opinion civil unions should be allowed to be performed by anyone that the state allows to perform marriages.
      I really don’t see a need for an extra step. No need whatsoever. If states don’t allow all persons who can perform marriages to also do civil unions, that’s just stupid. Why tie up the justice of the peace or whomever when other avenues can be opened up?

      Aug 25, 2008 at 3:36 pm   rating: 3  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.15   TL

      C_B:

      1) gays are not “a people”.

      2) gays are saying they need to be allowed to marry for the legal protections marriage affords.

      3) whenever a state legislature proposes Civil Unions which will give the same legal protections as marriage, the gays go bat-shit and want marriage not civil unions.

      Question: if it’s about rights and legal protections why not accept Civil Unions?
      Answer: Because it’s all about being able to smile a little smile and say “we’re married”.

      Replace “gays” with “blacks”, “marriage” with “sit anywhere on the bus” and “civil union” with “sit in the back of the bus” and there ya go.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 6:31 pm   rating: 25  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.16   Vampy

      Ok, interjection here.

      What exactly is the difference between a Civil Union and a Marriage?

      Aug 25, 2008 at 6:36 pm   rating: 0  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.17   Canthz_B bang

      Yes, TL, there you go.

      There you go changing apples to oranges and then saying they’re the same thing.

      You cannot substantively redefine an argument and then claim it’s the same argument. :roll:

      Aug 25, 2008 at 6:46 pm   rating: 7  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.18   Krystal Pistol

      Civil unions…..seperate, but equal?

      Aug 25, 2008 at 6:49 pm   rating: 15  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.19   Canthz_B bang

      Vampy, what’s the difference between a Collie and an Irish Setter?

      Different breeds, but still both are dogs.
      A rose by any other name…

      Yes, KP…with a properly written law.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 6:50 pm   rating: 2  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.20   TL

      You cannot substantively redefine an argument and then claim it’s the same argument.

      Yes, I can, because yes, it is.

      They can have civil unions, but not marriages. Because the front of the bus is where we sit.

      But don’t let me stop you from continuing to marginalize a group of people that is different than your group of people.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 6:53 pm   rating: 24  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.21   Vampy

      I’m asking what the difference is supposed to be because I am a straight married woman who actually did not get married in a religious ceremony, and no mention of God in any way, shape or form took place. We married in a secular hall, by a JP.

      So technically my marriage is a Civil Union. It’s recognized by the law of Canada. We did not marry in a Church or other place of worship and without the blessing of a religious person, being that my husband is an atheist and I am a neo-Pagan. So when someone tries to shift gays from marriage to civil union to make themselves feel better about the issue, it makes me wonder at how they would view my non-religious marriage.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 6:55 pm   rating: 5  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.22   Canthz_B bang

      After all, Krystal, we’re talking about marriage licenses…not public accomodations, school buildings and supplies, or housing.
      The legal protections afforded by Marriage and Civil Union MUST be equal. Anything less cannot be tolerated by either side of this debate.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 6:55 pm   rating: 3  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.23   Canthz_B bang

      Vampy, to my mind as long as you consider yourselves married, you’re married. Who cares what anyone else thinks of your religious views on the matter?

      Aug 25, 2008 at 7:00 pm   rating: 3  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.24   Vampy

      CB, it just bugs me when I hear someone say something along the lines of “Well, why can’t gays have legal civil unions instead of marriages”. I’m having a hard time articulating my thoughts here, but I perceive that by relegating gay marriage as a civil union, these people are in their own heads considering a civil union to not be a marriage at all.

      When I, and every other person who has married in a purely ‘civil union’ knows for a fact that it’s a marriage. The law says I’m married. So these people trying to make it somehow different aren’t quite grasping that it’s still a marriage and can be called a marriage. I mean, I don’t refer to my relationship as a ‘union’, it’s a marriage.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 7:05 pm   rating: 7  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.25   Canthz_B bang

      TL, you are exhibiting an inferiority complex when no superiority is being expressed.

      You sound like you are assigning prestige and value to mere terms.

      How can anyone know of your marital status just by looking at you like someone can know to assign a person to a certain bus seat by their evident skin color??

      Apples and oranges, my friend.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 7:07 pm   rating: 2  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.26   Krystal Pistol

      CB, there are those who would and do deny us those “special rights” too.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 7:11 pm   rating: 4  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.27   Canthz_B bang

      Not at all, Vampy. What they are saying is that they feel that marriage should be between a man and a woman, but that gays and lesbians new legal recourse to protect their rights as loving couples as well and that to their minds Civil Union is a fair way of affording these rights without muddying the waters as to what they perceive the term marriage to mean.

      Be that as it may, my marriages, one in church, one at city hall, were both marriages to me and neither affected my level of love and affection for my wives on bit.
      And the sharing of our love was what was most important to me. They could have called it llama shit for all I cared.
      My girl and I were one.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 7:27 pm   rating: 3  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.28   Canthz_B bang

      Krystal, please forgive me, but what “special rights” are you referring to? :?:

      Aug 25, 2008 at 7:30 pm   rating: 2  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.29   Vampy

      CB, I hear you and agree. I said I was having a hard time articulating how the arguement these people put forth makes me feel.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 7:34 pm   rating: 0  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.30   hamburke

      I got the solution which you all kind of talked around – make the state recognize them ALL – gay or straight – as civil unions and have marriage be what it was supposed to be – the religious aspect (one of the 7 sacraments in the Catholic Church).

      Vampy – I don’t get why you are being defensive. You view your (legally speaking) civil union as a marriage. Who cares what a bunch of old windbags think? Does it change your legal rights as an individual or as a couple? does it change how you feel about your hubby? will it affect the legal rights of your children (if you have any)? To me, it’s like using a synonym – perhaps there is a slightly different connotation but they mean the same thing.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 8:50 pm   rating: 1  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.31   Vampy

      hamburke, not when you look at it the way I’m trying hard to articulate.

      By reserving the term marriage solely for “Catholics” (and btw, Catholics aren’t the only faith in the world my friend, and they aren’t the only ones who have a religious ceremony surrounding the union of two individuals), and regulating everyone else to ‘civil union’, they are in fact, devaluing the non-religious marriages, gay or straight.

      I have a ‘civil union’, in that my husband and I stood in front of a JP, with all our loved ones as witnessess, and vowed to be loving and faithful to one another until the end of time. Gay and lesbian couples do the same (where it’s legal, like here in Canada). And yet, by your first paragraph, neither is a ‘marriage’ because it was not done in front of a priest, a rabbi, an iman, a high priestess, or Satan’s chosen one.

      Marriage pre-dates the Abrahamic faiths of Judaism, Christianity and Islam, and frankly, many didn’t take place in front of religious authorities for the majority of people, likely only for high ranking and very important people (incidently, in at least Christianity, for many centuries, it was the same. Only royals and nobles were married in a religious ceremony, everyone else hooked up without the benefit).

      So therefore, your arguement of what ‘marriage’ is ‘supposed to be’ fails in the face of history. Even within the scant 2,000 years that Christianity has been around.

      I have a civil union. It is a marriage. The gay couple down the street married at a gay friendly Christian church that is happy and willing to perform same sex marriages. They have a marriage.

      The difference?

      Aug 25, 2008 at 9:08 pm   rating: 0  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.32   Canthz_B bang

      No, see, that’s the thing!
      Gays in America first…..

      No one else in America is devaluing Civil Unions except the gay and lesbian communities who insist on the term “marriage” to feel equal.
      Everyone else, except the crazies on the far-right, is saying “We agree you need EQUAL legal protection, but we’d rather call it civil union than marriage because to us marriage means male-female and we’re trying our best to find a niche for you that fits into modern times without upsetting our ancient traditions”.

      There is no devaluation in equality by a different name unless one chooses to devalue it.

      Now, if you’re talking about a schism in Canada between religious marriages and secular marriages (what you have called “Civil Union”), I don’t see the point personally.
      I’m not a religious guy, but I was taught that God is everywhere at once, so if vows are exchanged anywhere, even without a clergyman present, is that not still recognized by their God? Just like their prayers are when they pray without a clergyman present?
      Do people actually say that you cannot be married “in the eyes of God” if you don’t believe in God? First of all, they must have forgotten that their God is omnipotent and can recognize whatever he chooses. Second of all, if you’re a non-believer in their God, who cares what they think?

      The difference?….NONE!

      Kiss your hubby and tell him of your unending love.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 10:34 pm   rating: 2  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.33   Canthz_B bang

      Hamburke, I see what you are saying, but the state already recognizes church weddings as civil unions. The state can only recognize marriage as a legal contract because of the separation between church and state.
      What needs to be done now is to get the government to universally recognize gay civil unions as well.
      The fly in the ointment is that gays want it to be called marriage and most heterosexuals prefer the term “Civil Union”. A minority of Americans oppose gay union/marriage altogether.
      I think that if gays accept the term Civil Union they can have a bill passed next year, but if they insist on the term “marriage” nothing will pass.
      This is because most sympathetic heterosexuals across this wide nation view “marriage” as between a man and a woman.
      You can’t build a successful coalition without compromise.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 11:00 pm   rating: 2  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.34   Vampy

      I am having the WORST time trying to express my thoughts on this. I simply cannot articulate clearly what it is I’m trying to say.

      All I can really say is that a civil union IS a marriage, gay or straight. No ifs, ands or buts about it.

      (and CB, there is no schism in Canada between the terms, at least not at the Federal Government level. They call it marriage, be it gay or straight, at church or at city hall. They changed the wording in the constitution to define marriage as between two people, rather than a man and a woman. My attempts at explaining have everything to do with people who are ‘playing nice’ but still attempting to separate with words.)

      Aug 26, 2008 at 2:16 pm   rating: 2  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.35   unholyghost2003 bang

      “I have a civil union. It is a marriage. The gay couple down the street married at a gay friendly Christian church that is happy and willing to perform same sex marriages. They have a marriage.

      The difference?”

      The difference is in the contract language. YOU have a Civil Union. The gay couple has a marriage. I can call those flashes in the sky ‘Shooting stars’ and get my meaning across but I would be more accurate to call them meteors.

      Aug 26, 2008 at 2:43 pm   rating: 1  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.36   ihityouinthenose bang

      vampy, surely you understand that not all countries follow Canadian law, yes? While there may not be a difference between civil unions and marriage where you live, there is a huge difference in the US. btw, i live in the United States and i am, therefore, concerned with US law on this subject.

      here, a marriage is something which all people can obtain. the problem is that for gay couples this marriage is not recognized on a federal level. because there is a separation of church and state, marriages between heterosexual couples are viewed by the law as civil unions. these unions are recognized by federal law and by all state laws. this is not the same for same sex couples. for example, if a gay couple is married in Massachusetts, the state allows them all of the protections they can provide….on a state level. because the marriage is not recognized federally or by other states, the gay couple will receive none of the federal protections, benefits, or responsibilities normally available through marriage. to the rest of the country, this gay couple is not married.

      civil unions are unequal. they will never be equal. marriage is marriage. civil unions are not marriages. not here at least….

      Aug 26, 2008 at 3:17 pm   rating: 12  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.37   Vampy

      ihityouinthenose: Well DUH. I’m not so freaking stupid as to think that all nations in this world follow the laws of one country.

      Seriously. That opening sentence just negated your entire response to the “jackass” pile. As in: didn’t read further cause you’re a jackass.

      unholyghost: Then why does the government define my ‘civil union’ as ‘marriage’. See, all those forms where there’s a checkbox asking for marital status….none of them ask ‘civil union’.

      Aug 26, 2008 at 4:14 pm   rating: 1  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.38   unholyghost2003 bang

      Because the world is full of stupid people. Just because two words are interchangeable in the common vernacular doesn’t mean they are ACTUALLY interchangeable. Government forms are NOT the high water mark of proper language use or even proper legal language.

      Aug 26, 2008 at 4:23 pm   rating: 2  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.39   ihityouinthenose bang

      point taken. i re-read your posts and you don’t insinuate that you believe your local laws are utilized worldwide. sorry about the snark…i’m caught up in the argument here. however, i stand by the rest of my comment.

      here, gay married couples are expected to fill out federal level forms as if they are not married in most situations. your civil union affords you a lot more rights than one would for gay people in the US.

      Aug 26, 2008 at 4:30 pm   rating: 3  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.40   Vampy

      While I know it’s in Canada, Quebec specifically, here is a definition of civil union:

      http://www.justice.gouv.qc.ca/english/publications/generale/union-civ-a.htm

      “In June 2002, the National Assembly of Québec passed the Act instituting civil unions and establishing new rules of filiation. This created the civil union, a new institution that allows same-sex or opposite-sex couples to make a public commitment to live together and comply with the resulting rights and obligations.
      In terms of its form and legal consequences, a civil union is equivalent to a marriage, since the rights and obligations created by a civil union are generally the same as those resulting from a marriage. However, there are a few differences concerning the age at which individuals may form a union and the process for dissolving the union.”

      “Court clerks, deputy court clerks, notaries and any other individuals designated by the Minister of Justice, such as elected municipal representatives or officials, are authorized to celebrate civil unions. Priests, rabbis, pastors or ministers of religion, previously appointed by the various religious societies to which they belong and authorized by the registrar of civil status, are also entitled to celebrate civil unions. However, no minister of religion can be required to celebrate a civil union if it is against his or her beliefs.

      The celebration of a civil union is subject to the rules that apply to marriage. The celebrant must post a notice 20 days before the date set for celebrating the union, at the place where the ceremony is to take place as well as at the nearest courthouse. The notice must include the name, domicilary address and date and place of birth of each of the intended spouses. When the union is formed, the spouses, the celebrant and the witnesses must sign a declaration of civil union. This is then forwarded to the registrar of civil status, who draws up the act of civil union and records it in the register of civil status.”

      In Ontario, where I live, it’s generally called a civil marriage:

      http://www.gov.on.ca/ont/portal/!ut/p/.cmd/cs/.ce/7_0_A/.s/7_0_252/_s.7_0_A/7_0_252/_l/en?docid=012201

      “If you are getting married in Ontario, you may have a religious marriage or a civil marriage.

      Religious marriage
      A religious marriage is performed by a religious official of a recognized religious organization who has received authorization from the Office of the Registrar General to perform marriages in Ontario under the Marriage Act. The marriage can be solemnized under the authority of a marriage licence or the publication of banns, depending on the religious body.

      Note: Banns shall not be published where either parties to the intended marriage had a previous marriage which has been dissolved or annulled.

      Civil marriage
      An Ontario judge, justice of the peace or municipal clerk may perform a marriage under the authority of a marriage licence. Each municipality will set its own fees and now has the option to offer civil marriage services. Contact your municipal office for more information. ”

      so therefore unholyghost, the terms ARE interchangable WHERE I LIVE. Under MY COUNTRY’S laws. HERE, it’s a marriage, gay or straight, religious or secular.

      It seems that in the US, for some reason, the phrase relates only to same sex couples. It seems from my research, you actually do not have a term that I can find that defines a marriage that takes place outside of any given faith. Up here, ‘Civil’ refers to a secular marriage.

      So that may be why I get so bothered by it all. Because I define Civil Union the way my country does. It’s a marriage here. (however, please note that California and Massachusetts actually do offer full on same sex marriage and not just the US defined Civil Union.)

      And ihityouinthenose, I accept your apology.

      Aug 26, 2008 at 9:07 pm   rating: 0  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.41   Arne

      There’s gotta be a bumper sticker that sums all this up nicely somewhere…

      Oct 16, 2008 at 2:11 pm   rating: 0  small thumbs up

       
    • #14.42   Indigo

      “‘but we’d rather call it civil union than marriage because to us marriage means male-female and we’re trying our best to find a niche for you that fits into modern times without upsetting our ancient traditions’.”
      Um, that sounds like unequal rights to me.
      I don’t believe marrying makes you love someone more, or that it’s an ultimate expression of love, or that you need to do to show someone that you DO love them and don’t want to leave them. However, there are plenty of people out there who DO believe that sort of thing, and if they’re gay, they should be able to do it exactly the same way straight people can.

      Jan 16, 2009 at 10:53 am   rating: 4  small thumbs up

       
     
  • #15   Bob

    Whether you agree with his response (/ views) or not the truth is, the notice is about a theft.
    The content of the stolen sticker is secondary, despite this, already the thread is turning into one long flame war.

    Looking at the picture, the guys biggest problem seems to be that the ribbon shaped area of un-faded paint.
    Perhaps, if he doesn’t get the sticker back he can claim it as a ‘support the invisible man’ ribbon.

    Aug 25, 2008 at 12:49 am   rating: 11  small thumbs up

    • #15.1   morpho aurora bang

      it’s all tony’s fault
      if he had left a note that said “hey fucktard, you stole my decal, give it back NOW!” everything would be ok
      instead he went off about free speech and tolerance and distracted everybody
      what an asshole!

      :P

      Aug 25, 2008 at 12:57 am   rating: 13  small thumbs up

       
    • #15.2   Canthz_B bang

      I say we make Tony don the unitard and attend a gay pride festival. 8-)

      Aug 25, 2008 at 1:07 am   rating: 22  small thumbs up

       
    • #15.3   Miss Unloop

      Accessorize that with a fuschia feather boa, and Tony is ready to par-TAY!

      Aug 25, 2008 at 7:22 pm   rating: 3  small thumbs up

       
     
  • #16   Crash bang

    So it’s okay to steal if I’m for gay marriage , right ?
    I’ll use that as my excuse if I ever do so… :D

    Aug 25, 2008 at 12:59 am   rating: 8  small thumbs up

    • #16.1   BurstingAtTheSeams

      Oh, yes! I have an entire collection of things I’ve stolen depending on my views for the day.

      Today’s loot:
      3 Confederate Flags
      5 magnets just like the one on Tony’s car!
      1 Hummer
      3 Hybrids
      2 Obama yard-signs
      10 boxes toilet paper from Sams (you figure out why; I don’t have a politcal excuse for the TP yet)

      Aug 25, 2008 at 2:11 am   rating: 7  small thumbs up

       
    • #16.2   Crash bang

      What ?!?!
      No plastic, bobblehead Jesus ??

      WWJD ? C’mon…

      Aug 25, 2008 at 9:07 am   rating: 0  small thumbs up

       
    • #16.3   Futon

      I saw a vanity plate in AZ that read “WWJD.”

      My first thought was “not drive a brand new 500-series Mercedes.”

      My second thought was “not sit at the light and throw used tissues out the window.”

      My third, less PC thought was “on Monday he’ll be cutting my grass.”

      Aug 26, 2008 at 8:30 pm   rating: 3  small thumbs up

       
     
  • #17   random bob

    see sorry, but you guys aren’t quite getting it. Gays getting “married” doesn’t affect your rights. It takes away nothing from you.

    as I said, gays getting married doesn’t equate ‘normal’ marriages falling away.

    And WHY not support ‘just’ civil unions? Anyone here heard of history? Earl Warren? Separate but Equal doctrines? THAT’S why there’s the drive to reach ‘actual’ equality, in name & all.

    I’m not advocating the thief’s behavior, btw, only pointing out the hypocrisy of talking about being “tolerant” whilst holding up an intolerant view of equal marriage rights.

    Aug 25, 2008 at 1:12 am   rating: 25  small thumbs up

    • #17.1   Crash bang

      I won’t claim tolerance or intolerance…I just like that I can steal legally if I support gay marriage according to the feed back on this note…

      Saves me money…with the economy sucking and all, ya’ know :mrgreen:

      Aug 25, 2008 at 1:20 am   rating: 3  small thumbs up

       
    • #17.2   morpho aurora bang

      random – yes we do get it
      the point is, if you are preaching tolerance that means ya gotta tolerate the assholes preaching intolerance – otherwise, you are doing the same thing you accuse them of doing, which makes you just as much of a hypocrite

      Aug 25, 2008 at 1:26 am   rating: 9  small thumbs up

       
    • #17.3   Canthz_B bang

      I think it’s funny that just because we disagree about what tolerance is you assume I’m anti-gay marriage.
      Who someone else marries is none of my affair.

      But, to use the separate but equal doctrine ignores the history and social significance of marriage. I do wish gays would stop likening their agenda to the Black Civil Rights Movement!

      The purpose of marriage is to let the other males and females of a social group know that these two people are off the market sexually. In this way a man can know that his child is his own.
      Separate water fountains and restrooms and schools were a means of maintaining social dominance over a racial group. It served no public purpose.
      Gays getting married does not serve the societal purpose of creating a social contract that is supposed to make paternity lines clear.
      Civil union affords the legal protections otherwise afforded by marriage

      I’m not for or opposed…just pointing a few things out.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 1:40 am   rating: 7  small thumbs up

       
    • #17.4   amazon bang

      Random Bob,

      Gay marriage negates the meaningfulness of Britney Spears’ marriages, especially the two-day, just-for-fun, one.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 2:21 am   rating: 8  small thumbs up

       
    • #17.5   bean

      CB, for as smart as you are, you’re missing a lot of history yourself here.

      first off, it was not the BLACK civil rights movement. It was the Civil Rights Movement, and it was actually comprised of quite a few different groups, including women and gays. I won’t say that blacks didn’t have their own separate struggle within it, but to limit that incredible era to only a fight that blacks took up is demeaning to all the people who fought for it.

      Historically speaking, marriage has been a great many things. A way to create political alliances, a way to follow MATERNAL lines as well as paternal lines-not everyone followed a patriarchal heritage. But most importantly for our argument, it became a way for the Church to control politics, and that is the marriage most think about when they argue against the rights to gay marriage in America. So in that sense, a marriage is actually a religious ceremony, and when in a political institution it should be a civil union to ensure the separation of church and state; they have just become convoluted in this puritan founded experiment in representative democracy.

      So I say, get rid of marriage altogether. Why not just make everyone get a civil union in the eyes of the government, and if they want to get “married” they can all go to their respective churches.

      Besides, who the hell keeps track of paternal lineage anymore? Even Maury can’t keep up. And we aren’t exactly dependent upon oral histories of ____ begot ___; begot…

      Aug 25, 2008 at 5:08 pm   rating: 13  small thumbs up

       
    • #17.6   Canthz_B bang

      It depends upon which part of the Civil Rights Movements you’d like to focus on.
      The person I was responding to specifically alluded to separate but equal doctrines. That was about Blacks, not gays or women.
      Brown v. Board of Education was not about Gays or women either.
      The women’s suffrage movement was not about Blacks or gays, even though it was a civil rights movement.
      There was no single The Civil Rights Movement. There were a series of civil rights movements that found common ground and used similar tactics in the late 1960′s and early 1970′s. None of the movements were the same as any of the others. None better or more worthy than any other, but they were different movements for different causes and should not be linked for show or propaganda purposes.
      As I have said, nothing is black and white, that is why I rejected the linkages that were being proposed.
      Matriarchal systems do not require marriage to determine inheritance or succesion, Patriarchal systems do. Mama’s baby, papa’s maybe.
      While I did not attempt to list all of the purposes to which marriage has been put throughout the ages, I did attempt to list those which were germane to the subject matter at hand.
      The courts still keep track of paternal lineage.
      That’s why I paid child support for so many years. Like it or not, there’s still a place for it in our society.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 6:16 pm   rating: 5  small thumbs up

       
    • #17.7   bean

      Actually the Civil Rights Movement was a worldwide phenomenon from about 1960-1980, roughly. Most groups turned to violence, shouldn’t we be trying to learn from the mistakes of others to avoid similar ones in the future?

      I’ll give it to you that separate but equal was an identifiable trademark of the Black movement, but it doesn’t mean that they own that injustice.

      Marriage isn’t needed to identify parentage. It never has been. If you think that every man that had a child in a marriage was definitely the father of that child…you may need to watch more Maury. In Rome, for example, marriage was about politics and economy, Julius Caesar didn’t have Augustus, he adopted him. You don’t need marriage to know that. Like you said, that’s what the courts are for. Marriage has absolutely no holds over parentage at all. Adoption, and/or genetics do. So I just don’t think it’s a viable argument. Therefore there’s no rationale to have a technically equal, though legally separate form of union.

      You say nothing is black and white, but you are trying to make extremes out of these things, keep them apart from each other. The truth is though, that if everything is gray, we are all in it together.

      (yeah, I know I should get my own blog and lay off others, but I actually like your posts on here and just don’t understand how you could come to that conclusion. In all respect CB. Go team beaver pelts!)

      Aug 25, 2008 at 7:04 pm   rating: 5  small thumbs up

       
    • #17.8   bean

      fuck. I just wanted to say that boiling the gay rights movement down to just the right to get married is also an injustice to the all the people who have worked for it. The ability to allow homosexuals to walk freely, to work freely, to live freely…for the most part I will say that it has been one of the most bloodless revolutions in civil rights, and I would like it to stay that way, but they aren’t being granted all the rightful equality in the pursuit of happiness that the status quo heterosexuals enjoy.

      sex is always soo messy.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 7:32 pm   rating: 5  small thumbs up

       
    • #17.9   Canthz_B bang

      Bean, the NAACP was established in 1909. If they weren’t working for civil rights until 1960, just what would you say they were doing?
      The struggle for equal rights for all in the US is as old as the US.
      What? You think Frederick Douglas was not part of a civil rights movement?
      You don’t need to grant me anything on separate but equal, I just pointed out that that was the issue brought to me by another, so that is what I was addressing.
      As for marriage and paternity, it’s just the best society has. The fact of the matter is that even today a baby born to a wedded mother is legally the child of the husband. Even if they have been separated for a year, he still has to get a paternity test or he’s legally responsible for his wife’s child.
      Fortunately, we don’t live in Rome…unfortunately I’m not a student of ancient Rome and so will not comment on its customs which are meaningless in todays America.
      There are viable arguments, you just won’t hear them because they involve morals and mores.
      I’m not trying to make extremes, I’m trying to show that there is common ground that can be reached if both sides drop the ideology and become more pragmatic. Yes most of this is grey and we are all in it together…so stop trying to paint me as a foe just because I don’t agree with you 100%.
      You can’t get anything done by fighting with Moderates like me. You’ll just push us farther to the right. and before her.
      I have mad respect for the gay rights movement of the 1970′s…I remember Anita Bryant
      Too bad this got so far away from where any of us intended it to go, bean.

      Much respect back atcha! :-)

      Aug 25, 2008 at 7:52 pm   rating: 3  small thumbs up

       
    • #17.10   Canthz_B bang

      Damned edit timed out!…

      I have mad respect for the gay rights movement of the 1970’s…I remember Anita Bryant, and before her.
      I lived through what some here read in their history books.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 8:00 pm   rating: 0  small thumbs up

       
    • #17.11   Canthz_B bang

      That’s ok…you can click my name and find my blog to reach me, bean.

      Go to the bottom of this page ASAP and ask kerry to delete #17.11 so your email does not get filled by nut jobs!!!!!

      Aug 25, 2008 at 8:34 pm   rating: 0  small thumbs up

       
    • #17.12   bean

      ok um… I tried, but I’m too fuckin drunk to do that. how the fuck do you navigate that thing? seriously. anyways that’s just my spam email anyway. I don’t know how to send you a message via yahoo 360. it’s too complicated for my inebriated mind.

      Aug 26, 2008 at 4:32 am   rating: 0  small thumbs up

       
    • #17.13   Canthz_B bang

      ROTFLMAO :lol:

      I’ll take car of it, bean. :-D

      Aug 26, 2008 at 5:12 am   rating: 0  small thumbs up

       
     
  • #18   random bob

    you still don’t get it.

    I so much as said that I DID NOT advocate the thief’s behavior, I was merely pointing out where the hypocrisy was in Tony’s statements of tolerance whilst holding tight to a view of intolerance.

    I KNOW what tolerance means; I also understand that it’s laughable that people who preach intolerance can claim the need for tolerance of their view of… intolerance? Yeah, see that? doesn’t really make much sense. that’s the ONLY point I was making.

    The thievery is wrong no matter which way you slice it.

    Aug 25, 2008 at 1:30 am   rating: 11  small thumbs up

    • #18.1   Crash bang

      Damn…I need a new plan of action now… :?

      But seriously.
      I think any such illegal behavior makes one’s case less herd.
      It draws attention away from the point of view they wish to bring attention to.
      Tolerance to intolerance might make some people more tolerant, you never know.
      Anyway,
      Point in case…Gay marriage, Christian, or Obama…Your behavior reflects your belief…and what others will make of them.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 1:48 am   rating: 2  small thumbs up

       
    • #18.2   Canthz_B bang

      You’re not making a point. Either that or hypocrisy does not mean what you think it means.

      He can be intolerant of a thing and also be tolerant of the opposing views of others on that thing, and expect his intolerant view to be tolerated. That is not hypocrisy.
      Your problem is that you love to use the word “intolerant” instead of “opposed to”. :-)

      Aug 25, 2008 at 1:55 am   rating: 3  small thumbs up

       
    • #18.3   Crash bang

      My point is,
      If you want people to hear you, to conduct yourself in a way where the people will listen.
      Be an example…
      If your behavior is intolerant to others and you do intolerant things to others who don’t share your opinion or point of view, then instead of listening to the cause of your point, people will criticize the bad behavior you might display while trying to make your opinion or point herd.
      If one has intolerant behavior towards gay marriage another might see that person as a homo phoebe and that’s all they’ll see, is that’s he’s a homo phoebe who’s behavior is intolerable to anyone who opposes him.
      And then his point would be null because no one will listen.
      Same goes for anyone trying to make any point on any subject.
      But if you’re tolerant to those who are intolerant towards you, you might be an example to them…not necessarily that they’d agree with you, but you would be easier for the rest of the people to listen to because you are less of a threat to them with tolerance for their opinions.
      That’s the point I was trying to make.
      Anyway…

      Aug 25, 2008 at 2:34 am   rating: 3  small thumbs up

       
    • #18.4   AWAT

      Random Bob,

      I guess you don’t understand that CB is the only one here who understands intolerance. He’s cornered the market on it. Gays better not DARE compare their struggle to that for civil rights for African Americans, or else, apparently.

      I get where you’re coming from. I also don’t agree with theft, but I also agree that tolerating intolerance is BS.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 11:59 am   rating: 11  small thumbs up

       
    • #18.5   unholyghost2003 bang

      Random Bob and AWAT need to learn the difference between “tolerance” and “acceptance.”
      It is VERY possible to TOLERATE something while voicing a dissenting opinion.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 12:44 pm   rating: 4  small thumbs up

       
    • #18.6   Canthz_B bang

      I understand the difference between “intolerance” and being “opposed” to.

      No, I make no apologies for being perhaps the only one here who can relate to the Black Civil Rights Movement from the African American viewpoint. I regret nothing! ;-)

      I am not intolerant of gays, even though I am opposed to some portions of the gay agenda and in favor of others.
      The issues are not black and white no matter how hard you try to force others into a “you’re either for us or against us” box.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 3:20 pm   rating: 5  small thumbs up

       
     
  • #19   random bob

    also while I’m on the tirade:

    I actually do not believe it’s OK to withhold rights to people just because you don’t like it or them; I don’t think it should be “tolerated.” Because “Tolerating” it means being OK with second-class citizenry. “Tolerating” the withholding of rights to people – which do not negatively affect the rights of anyone else – is what Racial Segregation was about, in essence. It’s the same thing.

    It’s one thing to disagree with the idea of homosexuality as a “natural order” of things, quite another to deprive people of equal rights based on some trait.

    What I’m saying is, I’d be perfectly OK with a Bumpersticker that said “I think Homosexuality is WRONG,” whereas I’m totally against a bumpersticker that essentially says “Gays shouldn’t be allowed to have equal rights,” and find it hard to tolerate.

    Still though, stealing it was wrong, no disagreement.

    :-)

    Aug 25, 2008 at 1:40 am   rating: 25  small thumbs up

    • #19.1   Canthz_B bang

      You have a lot to learn about the history of Race in America. :-(

      You’re for censorship? I’m against the sentiment in the bumper sticker you described, not against the bumper sticker.

      Your ideas about “rights” are flawed, BTW.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 2:03 am   rating: 3  small thumbs up

       
     
  • #20   Natalie

    Hmm… I just don’t understand what STRNTH stands for…

    Saturn The?

    Stern… Thigh?

    Aug 25, 2008 at 1:44 am   rating: 2  small thumbs up

    • #20.1   BurstingAtTheSeams

      STRNTH was a secret message:

      Steal
      The Marriage
      Ribbon
      Now!
      THanks!

      With a secret message like that, the real question is why is Tony mad?

      Aug 25, 2008 at 2:16 am   rating: 31  small thumbs up

       
    • #20.2   kmd

      Ok, this actually made me laugh out loud.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 8:21 am   rating: 0  small thumbs up

       
    • #20.3   Goldie

      I thought it was a variable declaration: strNth. Clearly Tony is a fellow programmer. With that said, the best vanity plate I’ve ever seen on a VW bug was “FEATURE”.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 9:26 am   rating: 0  small thumbs up

       
    • #20.4   BetaCatarina

      No seriously, what the hell does STRNTH stand for??? I’m so confused!!!!!!!!!!!

      Aug 25, 2008 at 4:24 pm   rating: 0  small thumbs up

       
    • #20.5   se

      I’m assuming you’re joking, but in case you are really that stupid, how would you shorten strength to fit on a 6 letter license plate?
      Or do you pronounce strength as strengeth?

      Aug 25, 2008 at 6:10 pm   rating: 0  small thumbs up

       
    • #20.6   Miss Unloop

      Re: 20.1 -

      Thank you, thank you, THANK YOU for posting something fun finally! I want my old snarky PAN back!

      Aug 25, 2008 at 7:35 pm   rating: 1  small thumbs up

       
    • #20.7   bob

      This poor car just wants to be one of those that the strongmen use in competition… you know, the kind that get rigged up with those big suspenders and lifted as the strongmen walk…

      Aug 26, 2008 at 1:43 pm   rating: 1  small thumbs up

       
     
  • #21   Ashley

    I hate those fucking decals. They are about as useless as those “Support Our Troops” magnets people buy at the dollar store.

    If you are going to put a magnet or decal on your car, you are asking for it to be stolen. It’s removable. Are they not committed to their views enough that they would permanently place them on the car? It’s not like he’s driving a fucking Mercedes.

    Oh, and the last car I even saw one of those stickers on was my friend in high school who was a bible-abiding Christian at the time. Now she is living with her lesbian lover. Hmmm.

    Aug 25, 2008 at 1:55 am   rating: 9  small thumbs up

    • #21.1   Goldie

      True, true – it is very much removable. Which leads me to the next question: what if the damn thing just fell off? Wouldn’t that be hilarious, what with poor Tony thinking he’s a victim of a hate crime?

      Aug 25, 2008 at 9:28 am   rating: 4  small thumbs up

       
    • #21.2   Holiday Djinn

      This is an imperfect world. Screws fall out of things all the time. . . .

      Aug 26, 2008 at 1:42 pm   rating: 0  small thumbs up

       
     
  • #22   Fresca

    Failure to support the right of gays to marry does not negate a person’s right to his/her own property. Sorry, but someone’s difference of opinion about what rights the government has an obligation to protect does not entitle you to steal from them. I don’t care if they support slavery; it doesn’t mean you get to take their stuff.

    Aug 25, 2008 at 2:03 am   rating: 7  small thumbs up

     
  • #23   roxie

    I love how Tony is trying to make it a “challenge” lol

    Aug 25, 2008 at 2:18 am   rating: 1  small thumbs up

    • #23.1   Miss Unloop

      “I look forward to meeting you on the field of battle at dawn! Engarde!”

      Aug 25, 2008 at 7:37 pm   rating: 3  small thumbs up

       
     
  • #24   aussielurker

    As a long-time reader, first-time poster, etc. and as a gay man, I have to butt in and say isn’t this thread getting off-track somewhat? The key point is overt political car add-ons and theft.

    From a cultural perspective, I find it interesting that no American posting finds this at all odd or strident at all. Personally, I find it a bit embarrassing that people feel so inclined to shout out their political views (or religion) in such a public and assertive way. This definitely would get some strange looks in Oz.

    I think the first sign, while silly, is to be expected if you go out show your political beliefs to the world via your number plate. Similarly, Tony has a right to his views and to deface his car in his own way, but stealing stickers off another person’s car is another matter.

    Feel free to have and display your political views, just keep your fucking hands off my property…

    Aug 25, 2008 at 2:26 am   rating: 26  small thumbs up

    • #24.1   Canthz_B bang

      From a cultural perspective, I find it interesting that no American posting finds this at all odd or strident at all.

      That may be because Americans tend to view our cars as extensions of ourselves. While the Obama plate is a bit over-zealous, bumper stickers proclaiming political affiliation, opinions or religious views are not unusual.
      Stealing someone’s sticker is almost akin to slapping him and shouting “SHUT UP”.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 2:43 am   rating: 1  small thumbs up

       
    • #24.2   claw71 bang

      I’m sorry, aussie, I didn’t read your post. I read “gay man” and “butt” within the same sentence and started snickering uncontrollably.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 7:58 am   rating: 7  small thumbs up

       
    • #24.3   Goldie

      del

      Aug 25, 2008 at 9:30 am   rating: 0  small thumbs up

       
     
  • #25   Natalie

    You know, I also always think that if you brazenly declare your political affiliation all over your car, you had better be a good driver, since your behavior now reflects on your candidate/cause.

    “Damn it! All those Obama supporters/Homophobes have no respect for the turn signal!”

    Aug 25, 2008 at 3:03 am   rating: 10  small thumbs up

    • #25.1   Goldie

      I know! I put the Coexist sticker on my car and now I cannot flip other drivers off anymore. It is a life of misery. I should’ve thought ahead.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 9:32 am   rating: 14  small thumbs up

       
    • #25.2   unholyghost2003 bang

      I put Homebrew/Microbrew stickers on my car. If I fuck up traffic laws people will just assume I’m drunk.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 9:47 am   rating: 15  small thumbs up

       
    • #25.3   claw71 bang

      There’s a guy I did some work with who has a pot leaf sticker on his back window right over a “Fuck the Police” decal. He’s black, his windows are tinted darker than the law allows, he blasts his music and he’s rolling on a set of 22 inch spinning rims. I gave him his rap handle: MC Death Wish.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 10:21 am   rating: 16  small thumbs up

       
    • #25.4   Loon

      Lol!

      I like the way you think!

      Aug 25, 2008 at 10:32 am   rating: 0  small thumbs up

       
     
  • #26   claw71 bang

    I consider myself a pretty ballsy, outspoken guy. I’m not afraid to express ideas that subject me to scorn and criticism. That being said, I don’t see the need to drag my car into the fray. Regardless of which side you choose to stand, there are crazy people who will do horrible things if they disagree with your sentiment. I don’t even like to proclaim my sports loyalties because of idiot fans from the other side. An “Obama” vanity plate seems to be somewhat risky, especially in Texas. Before this election is over I predict that the car in question ends up lynched.

    As for Tony, I certainly don’t agree with his views, but given the temporary nature of his decorations there I suspect he’s a little ambivalent himself. Maybe it’s because Tony, like so many other conservatives, enjoys a little guy on guy action from time to time.

    Aug 25, 2008 at 5:58 am   rating: 12  small thumbs up

    • #26.1   Canthz_B bang

      Tony’s car is his blog on wheels.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 6:27 am   rating: 3  small thumbs up

       
    • #26.2   Canthz_B bang

      An Automoblog! :-P

      Aug 25, 2008 at 6:30 am   rating: 7  small thumbs up

       
    • #26.3   amy d bang

      It’s a VW Blog. :D

      Aug 25, 2008 at 6:58 am   rating: 8  small thumbs up

       
     
  • #27   claw71 bang

    I hate magnetic decals, especially these ubiquitous ribbons. Men and women are overseas dying and the extent of your support is stupid magnetic yellow ribbon. So when the war is finally over you can readily remove that decal and your car is as good as new, but when Johnny comes marching home… oh, that’s right his leg was blown off, he can’t march. Ever again. But hey, you did your part by supporting him, with a $1.79 investment. Thank you for your sacrifice.

    Aug 25, 2008 at 6:07 am   rating: 16  small thumbs up

    • #27.1   kmd

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xlUyNmUABbc

      Thanks For the Support
      words and music by Roy Zimmerman
      © 2007

      You’ve got that yellow ribbon stuck on your H-2
      Thanks for the support
      Memorial Day weekend you threw a bar-b-que
      Thanks for the support

      I can feel the love seven thousand miles away
      And I’m a partiot, as I was trying to say
      When you cut me short
      Thanks for the support

      I was gunning for Osama, and you sent me for Saddam
      Thanks for the support
      Now I’m sitting down to dinner – it’s another can of Spam
      Thanks for the support

      You say complete the mission, and I say count on me
      ‘Cause I don’t even know what mission there might be
      To abort
      Thanks for the support

      You sent me here a third time, and my house was repossessed
      Thanks for the support
      Now my wife is in a trailer, but she sent a kevlar vest
      Thanks for the support

      And I think of her only every time I bleed
      And someday we will meet again at Walter Reed
      The resort of last resort
      Thanks for the support

      And you hired those mercenaries who make eight times what I do
      Thanks for that
      And you dropped in on Thanksgiving with a turkey and a camera crew
      Thanks…giving

      Now you’re giving guns to the ones who shot at me
      The tank is full, but the strategy might be
      Down a quart
      Thanks for the support

      I ‘preciate the stopgap, and I ‘preciate the Surge
      Thanks for the support
      Another twenty thousand voices to harmonize this dirge
      Thanks for the support

      And to the Democratic Congress who could have brought me home
      Who must have come down with a new Gulf War Syndrome
      Of some sort
      Thanks for the support

      And if I die tomorrow, won’t you ship me home at night
      Thanks for the support
      And if I have a funeral, make sure it’s outta sight
      Thanks for the support

      In the final seconds you’ve got a plan to win
      Cut those taxes and let Jesus put one in
      From half-court
      Thanks for the support

      Aug 25, 2008 at 8:24 am   rating: 10  small thumbs up

       
    • #27.2   Phalange

      I don’t just hate decals like the yellow ribbons, I despise them. We all support the troops when the government takes its cut of our paycheck. Unless you’re actually clearing out IEDs from the side of the road in Iraq, you’re not supporting the troops more than anyone else because you have a dumb fucking decal on your car.

      The same thing goes for the douchenuggets who have about 20 9/11 stickers plastered on the back of their shit mobile. “Never Forget” – oh thanks, I almost forgot about the worst domestic terror attack in US history, but thankfully I was reminded by your shitty made-in-China bumper sticker on the back of your Chevy Suburban. There are plenty of ways to show your love for this great country we live in – turning the back of your vehicle into a visual representation of a Toby Keith song isn’t one of them.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 8:45 am   rating: 12  small thumbs up

       
    • #27.3   Goldie

      Well I do have a doggy decal – you know: “I love my… (breed)” and so do a lot of people I know. This actually makes me wonder. Why do they sell doggy decals, but not doggy stickers? Are they implying that our car may outlive the dog and so the sign needs to be easily removable?…

      Aug 25, 2008 at 9:35 am   rating: 2  small thumbs up

       
    • #27.4   secondsout bang

      Like I usually do, I’ll quote the late, great George Carlin, “haven’t we gone a little overboard with these colored ribbons? Pink for breast cancer, red for AIDS, green for the rain forest, blue for child abuse, purple for domestic abuse. I’ve got a brown one. Know what it means? EAT SHIT, MOTHERFUCKER!!”

      See this clip at about the 9:40 mark.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 12:00 pm   rating: 6  small thumbs up

       
    • #27.5   hamburke

      Goldie – (btw – your name is the same as that of my first dog – fond memories that I associate whenever you post) I quite think that it’s the other way around – your dog might outlive your car and you’d like to take the magnet with you.

      okay, so you have all now seen the part of me that leans left – I don’t like how cars are really only designed to last 5-10 years, actually, I’m a former EPA employee (yup, I was the only admitted Republican in the building) and I’m not all that into much disposable items particularly technology.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 10:55 pm   rating: 1  small thumbs up

       
    • #27.6   clumber

      not to mention that “SUPPORT THE USA” or “…THE TROOPS” ribbon magnets are made in China. So it is more like “I Support 3 year olds in China who make these things”

      At least that’s how I read them…

      :P

      Sep 10, 2008 at 2:23 pm   rating: 2  small thumbs up

       
     
  • #28   bean

    god took the magnet. It was so important to Tony that He decided to take it to heaven and store it there.

    Aug 25, 2008 at 6:57 am   rating: 14  small thumbs up

     
  • #29   jokergirl

    If he’s so American, why does he drive a VW?

    …don’t tell me I’m the only person who noticed that.

    ;)

    Aug 25, 2008 at 7:06 am   rating: 0  small thumbs up

    • #29.1   amy d bang

      See comment #8 ;)

      Aug 25, 2008 at 7:08 am   rating: 3  small thumbs up

       
    • #29.2   Canthz_B bang

      I won’t tell you that. :-P

      Aug 25, 2008 at 7:23 am   rating: 2  small thumbs up

       
     
  • #30   amy d bang

    According to Tony, the decal thief doesn’t understand the definitions of “Free Speech” and “Tolerance”, but he expects him/her to display “courage” and “decency” in a manner consistent with those definitions?

    Aug 25, 2008 at 7:07 am   rating: 1  small thumbs up

     
  • #31   claw71 bang

    I know that Tony firmly believes that some granola-munching, tree-hugging, immigrant-harboring, wolf-snuggling, polar bear-kissing, queer-marrying, baby-killing liberal swiped his decal…and that remains a possibility. However, I believe the culprit is one of those polygamist mormons with a burr under his magic underwear about this whole defense of marriage movement. One man, one woman…that’s so quaker.

    Aug 25, 2008 at 7:53 am   rating: 13  small thumbs up

     
  • #32   Wade bang

    Magnetic Decals: When commitment to a cause is trumped by potential resale value.

    Aug 25, 2008 at 7:54 am   rating: 17  small thumbs up

     
  • #33   Holiday Djinn

    You figure whoever stole this magnet must have gotten a real sense of accomplishment. HA HA! I have silenced one more person! No longer shall this VW Bug be a travelling anti-gay statement!

    Team Theives are Douchenozzless!

    Aug 25, 2008 at 7:57 am   rating: 1  small thumbs up

     
  • #34   Wade bang

    I’m still trying to figure out the sticker in the back window. If he is trying to communicate “One Nation Under God”, shouldn’t the words be over the flag?

    Aug 25, 2008 at 8:24 am   rating: 5  small thumbs up

    • #34.1   claw71 bang

      No Wade, you just don’t get it and I wouldn’t expect a communist such as yourself to understand. That flag, our flag, is GOD’s flag. This is a Christian nation with a set of laws taken straight from The Bible, and when Betsy Ross first pieced together the first symbol of our nation she was guided by Divine Inspiration.

      Now, if you’ll excuse me I have to puke, I can’t stomach this crap even when I being satirical…How does Colbert do it?

      Aug 25, 2008 at 8:39 am   rating: 7  small thumbs up

       
    • #34.2   Phalange

      It seems like he could’ve made that statement in the form of one of those brain teasers we used to do in school when the teachers were too damn lazy to give us real work. In this case, we would’ve had:

      God
      Nation

      “God over Nation? No, that doesn’t make sense. God on top of Nation? Noooooo. Oooh Oooh I got it, One Nation Under God! Yahhhhh I’m smart.”

      Aug 25, 2008 at 8:53 am   rating: 0  small thumbs up

       
    • #34.3   Wade bang

      Maybe Tony is a crypto-Satanist, worshiping the undergod, whose wife tends bar in New Jersey, and whose infant son resides in Park Slope.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 10:37 am   rating: 4  small thumbs up

       
     
  • #35   aaa

    I’m going to laugh at Rachel in Austin if Obama loses. I’m going to laugh even harder if it turns out he’s a drug addict with a penchant for taping nasty sex between himself and people who aren’t his wife.

    Aug 25, 2008 at 9:18 am   rating: 0  small thumbs up

     
  • #36   claw71 bang

    Let’s be candid here, the only reason a person puts a sociopolitical message on a bumper sticker is to offend those who don’t agree with it. Sure, they’ll tell you that they’re trying to “raise awareness” or “encourage support” but most of the time these issues are far too complex to productively communicate on the back of a car.

    I’ve got stickers on my car. Yes, it’s lame but they’re mementos of places I’ve been and things I’ve done (like Runbarabara’s Mom) but those things aren’t there to remind me of those experiences, they’re on my vehicle to show all of you how well-traveled I am. It’s vanity, plain and simple. I’m seeking validation. In spite of all the surly posts, I need approval just like everybody else.

    I don’t put political or religions expressions on my car because I want to be relatively certain it will be operational when I need it. The last thing I want to do on a Monday afternoon is wait for a tow because some Bill Dobson wannabe slashed my tires to take out his frustration over my Darwin medallion. I suppose there’s an outside chance somebody will take umbrage to my rafting decals and one time I did have to explain that the Whiteface sticker was neither a racial slur nor an 80s rock band, but violence has yet to befall my van. I mean, the urge to throw a brick through the window of a car like Tony’s hits me every other day so I’d be a fool not to think that door swings the other way…right?

    The thing of it is, I get it. I enjoy offending people. I realize that comes as a shock to most of you here but, damn it, I do get a thrill out of pissing people off and I love taking the heat for it. I just don’t need some right-to-lifer rigging my car with explosives because he doesn’t like my Abortion: it does a body good sticker. I’d rather put that on a T-shirt and let him take a swing at me.

    I guess what I’m trying to say is that you really need to think about your motives when you get ready to bedazzle your car with some sort of message. So you don’t like gay marriage or you adore Barack Obama, that’s fair. We’re all entitled to our opinions, but what is your motivation for sharing your views on your car? Most of the time you’re saying: this is what I think and you can’t do a damned thing about it and that’s fine, except there is something they can do. Maybe you’ll get off with a note stuck to your window, or maybe they’ll snag your magnet. No, it’s not right but if that’s the worst that happens you can count yourself lucky.

    Aug 25, 2008 at 9:40 am   rating: 27  small thumbs up

    • #36.1   Phalange

      I’ve always wondered why people adorned their car with stickers and I believe you’ve just enlightened me.

      For the record, the one sticker I’ve put on my car over the years said – “My Other Ride is YOUR MOM.”

      Aug 25, 2008 at 10:35 am   rating: 2  small thumbs up

       
    • #36.2   pardon me

      I’m on Team “Put it on a T-Shirt”

      Aug 25, 2008 at 1:32 pm   rating: 1  small thumbs up

       
    • #36.3   mrs. pommelhorst

      I have an HRC equality sticker just so the babes will hit on me.

      It’s not all just for attack you know. :)

      Aug 25, 2008 at 5:09 pm   rating: 1  small thumbs up

       
    • #36.4   agirlie

      mine said “Visualize whirled peas”

      Aug 25, 2008 at 6:02 pm   rating: 0  small thumbs up

       
    • #36.5   ShizzStirrer

      I’m “If you are going to ride my ass, pull my hair while doing it.”

      Aug 26, 2008 at 5:37 pm   rating: 0  small thumbs up

       
     
  • #37   Goldie

    I don’t get the Obama vanity plate at all. No matter how much I like the guy, the plate will be severely outdated come November 5th. What do you do, get a new one every four years?
    When Obama pays fifty dollars of his money for a “Goldie” plate, I might consider getting the “Obama” one. Until then, I have better things to do with my $50.

    Aug 25, 2008 at 9:41 am   rating: 1  small thumbs up

     
  • #38   morpho aurora bang

    aww, give tony his decal back. I love it when assholes come with a warning label.

    Aug 25, 2008 at 9:59 am   rating: 29  small thumbs up

    • #38.1   why?

      Exactly the point. Why is he an asshole for having a personal opinion? It is your personal opinion that gay marriage is acceptable. It doesn’t matter what his reason is, he has a differing opinion. Not everyone believes in gay marriage and not everyone who is against it is an asshole. But since you don’t care, I think you’re an asshole for calling someone an asshole for having a differing opinion.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 9:02 pm   rating: 2  small thumbs up

       
    • #38.2   Canthz_B bang

      why?, can you say “joke”?
      Try sounding it out.

      What? You actually wanted an answer?
      He’s an asshole for having a “personal opinion” displayed in public thereby making it a public, not a personal, opinion.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 9:07 pm   rating: 3  small thumbs up

       
     
  • #39   what the holy hell

    If the gay rights movement is not likened to the black rights movement, what about all the homophobic violence (Matthew Shephard, the numerous numbers of transpeople who are killed and left for dead)? Just as there is an entire group against black people (the KKK), there is also an entire group against the ‘gay agenda’ (Fred Phelps and his ilk).

    Not allowing gays to marry IS an assertion of power by straight, Jesus/Allah lovin’ folk. They view it as ‘wrong’, and assume that they have the right to dictate who can do what. Just like it was ‘wrong’ for black people to have jobs or intermingle with whites.

    But what the fuck do I know? I live in Canada, and it’s legal here. GAY MARRIAGE AND WEED FOR EVERYONE!

    Aug 25, 2008 at 10:28 am   rating: 23  small thumbs up

    • #39.1   Canthz_B bang

      Equating opportunity to fairly prosper economically with opportunity to get married is a bit of a stretch.

      Just because two groups struggle does not make their struggles the same.

      But it’s really not such a big deal. :-)

      Aug 25, 2008 at 11:12 am   rating: 2  small thumbs up

       
    • #39.2   snee bang

      GAY MARRIAGE AND WEED FOR EVERYONE!

      that’s exactly what my bumpersticker says!

      Aug 25, 2008 at 11:32 am   rating: 3  small thumbs up

       
    • #39.3   Mishee bang

      hmmm.. .my first bumpersticker was “Grow your own dope: Plant a man”

      But that’s just me…

      I also had one that said

      “officer will this sticker saying
      SUPPORT LAW ENFORCEMENT
      stop you from giving me a ticket?”

      Aug 25, 2008 at 11:37 am   rating: 3  small thumbs up

       
    • #39.4   unholyghost2003 bang

      but but but I don’t WANT to smoke weed and I like cock!

      Aug 25, 2008 at 11:42 am   rating: 2  small thumbs up

       
    • #39.5   amy d bang

      But could you tolerate it, uhg? :P

      *stands next to Snee before JoP, seals the deal with a shotgun kiss*

      Aug 25, 2008 at 12:49 pm   rating: 2  small thumbs up

       
    • #39.6   unholyghost2003 bang

      Oh! I can TOTALLY TOLERATE it amy my dear!

      Aug 25, 2008 at 12:52 pm   rating: 0  small thumbs up

       
    • #39.7   snee bang

      i really wanted a white wedding…

      Aug 25, 2008 at 12:54 pm   rating: 1  small thumbs up

       
    • #39.8   amy d bang

      We can play that song at the reception, Snee.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 1:04 pm   rating: 2  small thumbs up

       
    • #39.9   Holiday Djinn

      Gay Marriage and Weed for everyone?!?!

      Does this mean when I go to Vancouver to check out “The Scene” that I automatically get a dick in the ass? Because if it does. . . . . . .. . . . .

      Aug 25, 2008 at 4:13 pm   rating: 0  small thumbs up

       
     
  • #40   Naomi

    Ah, God bless America.

    Aug 25, 2008 at 11:41 am   rating: 1  small thumbs up

     
  • #41   Kim

    If I saw tony’s car I just might key it.

    No one wants to see your hate speech.

    Aug 25, 2008 at 11:46 am   rating: 6  small thumbs up

    • #41.1   unholyghost2003 bang

      WOW. And no one wants their car keyed. Enjoy your fine/ night in jail Kim. You are a horrible human being.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 11:51 am   rating: 4  small thumbs up

       
    • #41.2   bean

      I was thinking the same thing; he’s lucky they just stole a magnet, and didn’t key his car!

      You carry around shit like that on your car, and you’re gonna get flack for it, as has so eloquently been put out there.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 4:47 pm   rating: 4  small thumbs up

       
    • #41.3   hate speech. HA

      It’s NOT hate speech. Everyone throws those words around without understanding their true meaning. EVERYTHING is hate speech?

      You talking about keying someone’s car because you HATE what they have to say, isn’t that hate speech?

      Aug 25, 2008 at 9:05 pm   rating: 5  small thumbs up

       
    • #41.4   Nix

      As dumb as Tony’s sticker is, keying his car is not very likely to sway him to the other extreme of thinking. Just food for thought.

      Aug 25, 2008 at 10:38 pm   rating: 5  small thumbs up

       
     
  • #42   schrodingersduck bang

    American license plate look so much more fun than British ones – in the UK, license plates have to fit the form XX99 XXX (or for older plates, X999 XXX), and must be printed on plain yellow and white (a European flag is optional for driving in Europe). They can’t have an political statements or offensive words, including those in other languages. There’s also a heavy tax on vanity plates.

    As a result, the only people who get plates are the ones willing to pay £500 (not a typo) for “TO55 ERZ” or “BO08 YES”. Where’s the fun in that?!

    Aug 25, 2008 at 11:52 am   rating: 0  small thumbs up

     
  • #43   AWAT

    When did RB suggest censorship? He was just stating his opinions about what he prefers. Your ideas about how to read this thread are flawed, CB.

    Aug 25, 2008 at 12:02 pm   rating: 1  small thumbs up

    • #43.1   Canthz_B bang

      whereas I’m totally against a bumpersticker that essentially says “Gays shouldn’t be allowed to have equal rights,”

      My point, which I clearly stated, is that you should be against the offensive message on the bumper sticker, not against bumper stickers that carry offensive messages.

      I’m against offensive messages as well, just not against people having the right to hold views I find offensive.

      I’m also against being told that I “don’t get it” just because I don’t agree with you. As if your opinion is so very right that anyone who disagrees with you just does not understand how right you are.
      That’s so intolerant. :roll:

      Aug 25, 2008 at 2:45 pm   rating: 6  small thumbs up

       
     
  • #44   Sabrina

    Everybody knows VW Beetles are for women, anyway.

    Aug 25, 2008 at 4:31 pm   rating: 3  small thumbs up

     
  • #45   bean

    Obama Sucks!!! looks like it was written by a seven year old. Seriously, what adult makes their b’s with a circle line? I’m surprised it’s on college rule, and not three lined paper. Oh wait…

    Aug 25, 2008 at 7:37 pm   rating: 0  small thumbs up

     
  • #46   Nix

    Tony clearly needs a boyfriend.

    Aug 25, 2008 at 10:36 pm   rating: 2  small thumbs up

     
  • #47   zombieBlanco bang

    meh

    Aug 26, 2008 at 1:15 am   rating: 0  small thumbs up

     
  • #48   drunkard

    sorry when I get drunk..before I get in my car to drive home I steal people’s decals from their cars in the parking garage.. but they are only ones I want to use myself .. passing it on :)

    Aug 26, 2008 at 4:02 am   rating: 0  small thumbs up

    • #48.1   Goldie

      From the office parking garage? When you’re drunk?? Are you guys hiring by any chance?

      Aug 26, 2008 at 8:33 am   rating: 0  small thumbs up

       
     
  • #49   bobby

    When I bought my friend’s car I left on the sticker that said, “You Lost Get Over It” with the confederate flag crossed out. Within a few months, it was ripped off. Instead of writing a note and hoping it got to the person who stole it, I just felt disturbed by probable racists in my hometown. If it’s not white pride, it’s southern pride, but Iowa isn’t even part of the south.

    Aug 26, 2008 at 1:21 pm   rating: 2  small thumbs up

     
  • #50   Drunkbunny

    I saw a one of those ribbon magnets on a car in a parking lot once that said “SUPPORT LAW ENFORCEMENT”. While I completely agree with the sentiment, I thought about how ironic it would be if I stole it. ;)

    “Yes, 911? I’d like to report my ‘Support Law Enforcement’ magnet ribbon stolen… what, the cops don’t consider a $2 loss of property a dire emergency? LAW ENFORCEMENT SUCKS!” *click*

    Aug 27, 2008 at 8:35 am   rating: 0  small thumbs up

     
  • #51   RP

    Putting crap on or taking stuff off of people car’s is wrong. You have the right to say whatever you want.

    The rest of us have the right to disagree. I am not violating your right to free speech if I tell you that you’re silly, asinine, arrogant, wrong, ignorant, vapid, stupid, mean, racist, sexist, bigoted, touchy, whiny, insane, or whatever else your opinion happened to reveal about you.

    Aug 28, 2008 at 2:20 pm   rating: 5  small thumbs up

     
  • #52   Nini

    It is a sad world when people don’t realize when they themselves are being discriminatory. When the Bible was written it clearly defined marriage and those that believe in it have every right to voice their opinion just as much as those that are for same sex marriage. We have not progressed our thinking and don’t for a second think that humans in general are just becoming more tolerant of others… all we are doing is turning the table and instead of picking on homosexuals, we are now taking it out on all the Christians (and those denominations that claim to be).

    How often does someone get chewed out for calling a Christian something slanderous?? What about the other way around??? (Just read the other posts to find out)

    Aug 28, 2008 at 9:40 pm   rating: 0  small thumbs up

    • #52.1   Canthz_B bang

      Maybe that’s because so-called Christians who still feel the need to use phrases like “and those denominations that claim to be” have shown themselves to not fully practice Christian teaching?
      I’m not saying anything bad about Christians. Everyone has a right to their faith, I believe that.
      But if you’re going to profess it…try to live it. You cannot write a post about the wrongs of intolerance and be judgemental at the same time.
      “It is a sad world when people don’t realize when they themselves are being discriminatory. “

      Aug 29, 2008 at 3:58 am   rating: 1  small thumbs up

       
     
  • #53   meat.org

    Obama does suck, same jazz as Mccain.

    And heck yeah i would steal that lame ribbon magnet too. Two men or women marrying doesn’t involved you TONY. So let it be. Slash your tires while I’m at it. I kid i kid..or DO i?

    Sep 2, 2008 at 8:37 pm   rating: 0  small thumbs up

     
  • #54   pissive aggrissive

    yobama fuckins sux. only pierced eyebrow dweebs would steal a car magnet they don’t agree with. party hard on 11/3 dickbreaths. wake up about 6:59pm on 11/4, ok?

    Sep 6, 2008 at 12:01 am   rating: 0  small thumbs up

    • #54.1   Canthz_B bang

      Grow up. Neither candidate sucks.
      They just have different views.
      If it makes your nipples hard to throw mud and call names so be it.

      I do think it’s funny that Sarah Palin is receiving kudos and taking credit for delivering a great speech, which she didn’t write, in which she said not to consider a candidate’s speaking ability as evidence of substance.
      If we take her advice, shouldn’t we dismiss her words?

      Sep 6, 2008 at 2:27 am   rating: 3  small thumbs up

       
     
  • #55   Quizoid

    Here’s an odd coincidence:

    1) My name is Tony
    2) My birthday is June 26
    3) I’m in a domestic partnership with another man, in the process of paying close to a grand on legal papers to get us close to having some of the same rights as married couples (such as transferral of property on death and ability to make medical and property decisions for the other if one of us is unable) that I could get for about $60 if we were of opposite sex.

    For the record:
    ~ I’m all for free speech.
    ~ I hope conservative culture progresses to the point where they understand the wise words, “Separation of Church and State.” I’m not asking to be married in YOUR church, just mine.
    ~ I can be with my partner, live with him, share a bank account… totally be married. I just can’t have a few benefits and have to spend more on some things. All conservatives are fighting for is the right to keep inconveniencing my life. Whether the state recognizes my marriage or not is inconsequential to how I live.

    Sep 11, 2008 at 2:20 pm   rating: 3  small thumbs up

     
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  • #57   Wannabe

    For so-called conservatives, don’t you think it odd that you are advocating for the state define marriage at all? I mean, shouldn’t you be worried about the fact that the government has the right to regulate our personal lives to such a degree in the first place by creating the institution of marriage? Why should heterosexuals be the only ones allowed to live together in a way that allows them to receive privileges under the law? By that logic since I am not of the Pentacostal faith, all couple who are pentacostal should not be allowed to be lawfully married. Admit it, it is your religious/ social intolerance that causes you to be against gay marriage- and why should YOU be allowed to shove YOUR beliefs down our throat and base law on them?

    Oct 15, 2008 at 8:24 pm   rating: 1  small thumbs up

     
  • #58   a little bit of shameless gloating

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  • #59   Molly

    I hate the “Jesus says its wrong, therefore its wrong” argument. Not all of the founders of this nation were Christians. Some were agnostic, some were atheists. We were NOT founded as a Christian nation – unless you think they were just kidding about that whole First Amendment thing.

    The only reason to believe that homosexuality is wrong is religion. Take that out, and you’ve got nothing left. What happened to “love they neighbor” and “judge not lest ye be judged”? Or are you all exempt from your own so-called “rules”?

    Jan 26, 2009 at 11:03 pm   rating: 2  small thumbs up

     
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